It is rather obvious that Freedom Fry’s place of work does not compete for top talent.

Finland for quality reasons.
America for financial reasons.

I’m glad I don’t have to live in either country. Like comparing Hindenberg with Titanic. Which is better one?

- Right, in America, you have to wait in line for free health and dental care.
- In Finland the lines are just as long for free bread.

What’s worse, not being able to afford good care, or not beable to afford anything…

Tapio,
We have no slaves here. This is the land of ‘Take that job and shove it’ That’s Finland where whole towns are dependent on the local factory.

El Capone, Half of those 49 Million have access to health care and decline to take it. A good portion of the remained are in fact not US Citizens. As it so happens, the Health care plans are not planning to cover illegal aliens, other than what they get already, when is pretty good. (This is why health care will come first and then mass amnesty, which will then give illegals full health care.)

Why the hell are you paying taxes in US in general? I mean in 99% of the places in the US, the roads are fucked up, public transportation is a health risk (even before it shows up), the cops show up if they feel like it, school education is mediocre at best, there’s trash everywhere, etc., etc…

And not to mention the 49 million US citizens who are forced to pay for bombs, etc., but will not get any kind of health care unless they’ve got a severed artery, a massive coronary, or something similar with a couple minutes of life to go for… like my neighbor.

Public health care works well in some countries, and doesn’t in others. Personally, I don’t care how the problem is solved (ensuring adequate health care for the 49 M tax paying US citizens)… but before it does, this country is a Thirld World country, so to speak.

That’s an excellent system for building an army of mindless, obedient corporate slaves. Do what you’re told or else. They seem to have done a great job with you. I have to admire the ingenuity of it all. What were the last US unemployment figures again?

“If they want to see a doctor, they see one the next day.”

Pathetic. I went to see a doctor last Wednesday. I walked into the office, without an appointment, at 7.40 pm and was talking to the doctor a quarter to eight. What’s truly amazing is that with the ridiculous money you pay for healthcare, getting an appointment the next day is frequently cited as some sort of a miracle.

By the way, if they miss work because of seeing the doctor, they get fired, right?

“And lets not overlook the little talked about fact that most people in ‘free healthcare Finland’ pay for private health insurance.”

Why yes, for instance the travel insurance that comes with my credit card covers acute illness. I believe the charge is around 50€ annually.

“The idea of an omnipotent board that makes unpopular decisions on access and price isn’t a new construct.”

Certainly not, that’s called an insurance company. You know, the kind where a CEO rakes in a 9-figure salary that gets paid by the taxpayers.

“American’s don’t like to wait for care. That will be one undoing of this bogus plan.”

I’ve posted this clip of “American’s” waiting for care before:

http://www.iltalehti.fi/nettitv/?7077969

Jesus. I’ll take my chances with the nanny state, thank you very much.

So you mean that you’re now paying inflated prices for medicines? Is that something you should be happy about? As a “Freedom Loving” American that is.

Healthcare in the US is better than in Finland for most Americans.

Most, but what about the rest? Of course, I mean that significant and growing minority of Americans who have pre-existing conditions that insurance companies won’t cover, and those who get denied claims only to be charged fraudulently inflated hospital charges which ultimately lead to personal bankruptcy. You realize that inflated medical bills are the number “1″ cause of bankruptcy in America, don’t you?

layers of bureaucracy like health boards have been specifically engineered to delay the adoption of new medical products and services, thus lowering spending.

Point taken, although I don’t see much difference compared to the US system. You know about the FDA? I’ve read that it takes LONGER to approve drugs in the USA, not shorter. Overall, in my experience, access to medicines and medical care is MUCH better in Europe (not necessarily Finland though) than in USA. At least they ACCEPT CASH in Europe. You can really get anything you want, because they know that you’ll go elsewhere if they don’t offer it to you. The improvement in European systems is a relatively recent phenomenon (last 5-years maybe?). In USA, they still look at cash customers with dumb facial expression and repeat, “Duh, what’s the name of your insurance company again?”

Everyone at the company I work at has better healthcare

Just keep being a good slave and they’ll let you keep it

In case you missed, here is one part of an article in today’s edition: Government Health Plans Always Ration Care – Europe offers a glimpse of the future if President Obama and congressional Democrats have their way.

——————–
The idea of an omnipotent board that makes unpopular decisions on access and price isn’t a new construct. It’s a European import. In countries such as France and Germany, layers of bureaucracy like health boards have been specifically engineered to delay the adoption of new medical products and services, thus lowering spending.

In France, assessment of medical products is done by the Committee for the Evaluation of Medicines. Reimbursement rates are set by the National Union of Sickness Insurance Funds, a group that also negotiates pay to doctors.

In Germany, the Federal Joint Committee regulates reimbursement and restrictions on prescribing, while the Institute for Quality and Efficiency in Healthcare does formal cost-effectiveness analysis. The Social Insurance Organization, technically a part of the Federal Joint Committee, is in charge of setting prices through a defined formula that monitors doctors’ prescribing behavior and sets their practice budgets. In the past 12 months, the 15 medical products and services that cleared this process spent an average 35 months under review. (The shortest review was 19 months, the longest 51.)

In short, other countries where government plays a large role in health care aren’t shy about rationing. Mr. Obama’s budget director has acknowledged that rationing reduces costs. Peter Orszag told Congress last year when he headed the Congressional Budget Office that spending can be “moderated” if “diffusion of existing costly services were slowed.”
——————–

American’s don’t like to wait for care. That will be one undoing of this bogus plan.

Why yes I do, very good care actually. Everyone at the company I work at has better healthcare than what they would get in Finland. If they want to see a doctor, they see one the next day. No waiting months for an MRI or months/years for a surgery.

And lets not overlook the little talked about fact that most people in ‘free healthcare Finland’ pay for private health insurance.

So go learn a little about these things before you trash them. I have lived in both countries and know both systems well. Healthcare in the US is better than in Finland for most Americans.

Finland should be paying attention to what is going on in the US, because if this disaster of ‘Universal’ care in the US is passed, that will mean higher prices in Finland, as the Drug companies will need to reprice their products since they will not be able to recover their R&D costs as easily from the US anymore.

The so-called murders in Katyn were a necessary measure to combat fascist terrorism. If anything, the NKVD didn’t go far enough. Try a little harder.

As if you had healthcare to “F” up.

– If he was spending anywhere near what Bush was spending would be one ting, however, Obama is spending as much money this year as Bush spent his whole four-year second term. And this coming from a guy who is promising to halve a deficit he himself doubled!

– All this spending does not include the additional money he wants to spend to F-up health care.

Has the kidnapper killed himself yet?