The earth is a pussy, man
What’s up with this depressing weather we’ve been having this winter?? It’s amazing, I’ve never experienced such consistent temperatures, it’s been between +3 and +5 for the past three months! Thank Jebus this isn’t my first winter here, cause I don’t think I’d have stayed for a second.
YLE made a bold statement the other day, “Global Warming Spawns 2nd Consecutive Mild Winter” although a few sentences later they said, “This may in turn be a result of global warming, says the FMI.” I’m no expert on the environment, so it’s impossible for me to say one way or the other, but if we’re still unsure whether global warming is happening or not, why take a chance? Like if there was a 50-50 chance a pack of wild wolves were gonna gobble me up, I wouldn’t waste time debating, I’d start running.
But seriously though, industrialization has been around what, 200 years? And already our planet is crapping out on us? The earth is a pussy, man. Either that or God really screwed things up. “On the 7th day, God drank heavily…”
rain, dark, repeat. it does suck man. at least in tampere we have some snow.
Comment by Stefan Constantinescu — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 11:08 am
It’s snowing here now at Nokia House. But I heard it’s getting back up to the plus degrees again this week.
Comment by Phil — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 11:13 am
What you describe sounds like temperate marine climate. In our case, we are warmed by the Gulf Stream. Other places that are warmed by the ocean similarly are Southern Chile and Argentina, Europe, The Falkland Islands, Tasmania and Melbourne, New Zealand, The Northwest USA and Southwest Canada (Washington State, Oregon, British Columbia) That is the only way we are able to have weather that warm at this time of year.
I remember in winter 2002-2003, I was driving my car around on the sea. It can either be global warming or can be a transient trend. I don’t think global warming has happened in 3-4 years.
Comment by Sirkuspelle — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 11:40 am
I don’t think global warming has happened in 3-4 years.
I heard that Finland had a winter just like this back in 1973. So was it global warming back then too? Or is it just a freak incident here now?
Comment by Phil — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 11:46 am
“he FMI estimates that the unusually mild Decembers in 2006 and 2007 would have been an average of one degree colder if it were not for global climate change.”
- YLE
Is that means, if not Global Warming it would be +3C insted of +4C ??
Comment by Sandun — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 11:55 am
I am depressed.
And is way too early to have to drag around rubber outfits for my kids in day care and they come home totally muddy.
Comment by uncle sam — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 12:04 pm
The earth is warming. In the mid 70s they (the scientist) said we were in a cooling period and could be heading for another “little” ice age. No one really knows what is going on. It is all just shots in the dark. If next year we average -2 degrees below the norm are they going to see “we must have fixed the earth” To me it is just crappy weather. Since it is depressing I will just sit by my energy light and have another pint.
Comment by Winter sucks — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 12:54 pm
I think it has been established beyond doubt that the global temperature is rising. The dispute concerns man’s part in it. In any case, the climate is a complex system, and the rise in the global average does not necessarily mean that the average temperature at any given locality is rising short-term. For example, Finland’s relatively mild weather is due to the effect of the Gulf Stream. Take it away (there has been a drastic drop in the volume of the stream in just a few decades), we’ll be having severe winters like never before, despite global warming.
Comment by Anonymous — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 1:08 pm
#9 was mine.
Comment by aet75 — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 1:18 pm
Well that was kinda obvious. Meant to say #8 was mine.
Comment by aet75 — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 1:19 pm
“I think it has been established beyond doubt that the global temperature is rising. The dispute concerns man’s part in it.”
- Exactly.
Funny how it is much colder in the US than in Finland. Yesterday morning it was -9 and this morning it is -5. Now the whole planet is not warming. A good third of the US has been cooling for the past 100 year. (Southeastern US)
Exactly Who is the Global Warming Villain?
Comment by Fred Fry — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 1:27 pm
Well this sure isn’t what I was waiting for in a Finnish winter having just returned from a magnificent Australian summer
BTW, is it still global warming? I thought they changed it to man made global change to cover all bases…………
Comment by Punter — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 3:24 pm
It’s climate change.
Comment by m — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 4:08 pm
Yep, they’re right when it’s hot and right when it’s not that way.
Comment by Punter — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 5:54 pm
Actually, I think the truth of it is that we’re getting sooo incredibly wasteful as a species that we’ve squandered the resources built up over millions of years in just a few decades. Of course, those of us in western nations aren’t likely to be feeling the worst of it just yet, but the next time you see news of people dying in the third world, due to drought or flooding, try to keep the idea of climate change in mind.
Comment by The Jester — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 6:04 pm
“Yep, they’re right when it’s hot and right when it’s not that way.”
You’re ignorant beyond belief.
Comment by m — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 9:05 pm
Where is the ignorance in that statement? Saying it’s global warming doesn’t cut it when parts of the world will cool down if the trend continues (ie Finland and the gulf stream) while describing it as climate change allows for all cases. That makes it right in all cases or doesn’t it?
Now whether one agrees or not is a different matter but I didn’t mention anything about my opinion.
Ignorant? Learn to read.
Comment by Punter — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 10:21 pm
Depends where you’re standing really. Climate change perhaps explains it better on a localised level (particularly if you end up living somewhere where it ends up “cooling”, which is unlikely anyway). However, the average global temperature is rising, so the globe as a whole is warming. So, global warming is also technically a fair description.
The most extensive reports don’t really support the idea that any areas will substantially cool due to climate change. However, many areas are likely (and it’s already started) to suffer increased occasions of “extreme” weather, storms etc. So, this could be another reason why the term “climate change” is preferred by some to global warming. Perhaps, because of this, it is in fact more accurate as it encompasses more than just the rising temperatures.
In any case, I find it hard to believe that some people are still denying it is happening. Even 2-3 years ago, I could understand some sceptisism, but the amount of studies now is great and the evidence is now overwhelming. As a whole, scientists are an extremely cautious bunch, there would not be such broad agreement if it uncertain to the degree of not existing. There again, it took a while for people to believe the world wasn’t flat and that the sun didn’t go around the earth.
Comment by JG — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 10:56 pm
Phil: [...]but if we’re still unsure whether global warming is happening or not, why take a chance?
Exactly. No one is sure what will happen, and not everybody even claims to be. That’s why it pains me when some overly enthusiastic “green” pretends to know everything and tries to put others on a guilt trip. But even they usually accept that they might be wrong which is rarely the case with you “skeptics”.
All you really have to know is that human activity produces a lot of CO2 and that CO2 is a greenhouse gas. The details are complicated and predicting the global and local processes very hard indeed, but can you deny that we are doing something to our atmosphere? Why not just play it safe and start shifting to an economy that avoids these effects? Preferably as fast as possible.
Comment by Pave — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 11:51 pm
Punty, global warming means that the global mean temperature is rising. It really makes no difference if the temperature between your brain hemispheres is 0.15 K. The Earth is still warming.
Moreover, to use a stock market analogy you might understand, DJIA’s rise toward the end of the trading day today does not necessarily mean we’re in the middle of a bull market.
Phil, ever looked at your blog on the N800?
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Tue, Jan 22nd, 2008 @ 11:52 pm
Move to northern Lapland. There’s snow (although nothing compared to old times) and we can even see the sun again!
There has been a a lot of plus temperatures here too though. Before Christmas a December record temperature of over +7 degrees was measured in Ivalo.
Comment by Hihhuuliihei — Wed, Jan 23rd, 2008 @ 2:33 am
“Thank Jebus this isn’t my first winter here, cause I don’t think I’d have stayed for a second.”
Funny you say that, as this is my first winter spending at least two months here, I can concur with this statement. Not exactly the Finnish winter I signed up for. I’m actually heading to Munich in 5 days to ride my motorcycle north to Cologne in January!?! I thought my bike would be holed up in Germany until March, but apparently they’r not having much of a winter either.
Comment by Mike Giordano — Wed, Jan 23rd, 2008 @ 8:22 am
Yes Franky I understand the concept, just worried about the BS “man made” comment that always seems to preceed it…..
Comment by Punter — Wed, Jan 23rd, 2008 @ 12:40 pm
Well Punty, now that we have established that the Earth is indeed warming, and according to your eloquent assertion any sort of human involvement in this is “BS”, I am just dying to hear your alternate hypothesis.
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Thu, Jan 24th, 2008 @ 11:43 am
In glacial ice analysis going back some 160,000 years, beyond the previous glacial cycle, the amount of CO2 varied from 180 parts per million in the cold periods to 280 in the warm periods. The amount at the moment is quickly closing on 400, having climbed exponentially since the 1950s. No human influence at all?
http://www.aip.org/history/climate/co2.htm
Comment by aet75 — Thu, Jan 24th, 2008 @ 1:26 pm
#24-That is the problem with the whole subject and when did “we” establish the earth is warming? You suggest that. Yes there have been years of increased global temp but so what? What does it mean, what is causing it, how long will it last, has it occured before etc etc etc are all valid questions. The only problem is that unless we jump on the global warming train then we’re treated like freaks. Sorry but the common opinion isn’t always the right one and many scientists indeed question the common opinion.
http://www.channel4.com/science/microsites/G/great_global_warming_swindle/index.html
Comment by Punter — Fri, Jan 25th, 2008 @ 5:53 am
Channel4 program guide? I bet you didn’t even have a glance at the article I linked to. At least it has sources listed.
I bet even those advocating the flat earth theory became, at some point, to be viewed as freaks.
Comment by aet75 — Fri, Jan 25th, 2008 @ 12:59 pm
In fact it is the link to an alternative opinion documentary movie. Good glancing yourself. BTW, they have an interesting look at the arctic ice in the movie.
Comment by Punter — Fri, Jan 25th, 2008 @ 1:41 pm
@28: Touché.
Comment by aet75 — Fri, Jan 25th, 2008 @ 4:23 pm
“In fact it is the link to an alternative opinion documentary movie.”
The flat Earth theory was the prevailing opinion (with the masses, educated Europeans never believed that) until it became “alternative”.
Is that propaganda piece where the scientists have objected about their views being presented in a misleading way and the central hypothesis disproved (our Sun has in fact been cooling since 1985) really the best you can give? I’m not very convinced, mate.
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Sat, Jan 26th, 2008 @ 12:50 pm
As equally worthwhile as Al’s little piece. Only problem it presents an unpopular theory and hence becomes “propaganda” as you so nicely put it.
Others have called it a well researched and excellent documentary that makes Al’s effort seem like propaganda. (And as we all know, propaganda is something the US never use, think mobile chemical weapon labs etc…..)
Flat earth? Don’t make yourself seem more ridiculous than you already do.
Comment by Punter — Sat, Jan 26th, 2008 @ 4:24 pm
“Only problem it presents an unpopular theory”
Incorrect theories tend to be unpopular. That’s the way science works.
“Others have called it a well researched and excellent documentary”
From the link you posted:
“In August 2007, Mike Lockwood of the Rutherford Appleton Laboratory published a study which may have put the final nail in the coffin for the anti-CO2 brigade. He has shown than since 1985, solar activity has run in the opposite direction to global warming and therefore cannot explain rises in average global temperatures. If this study turns out to the true, then the arguments presented in this film lose much of their strength.”
Have you perhaps not understood what the above paragraph says?
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Sun, Jan 27th, 2008 @ 6:14 pm
Watch the damn documentary and then have a think about it. Oh, sorry. As a Finn you’re taught not to think but to follow the common line. I nearly forgot that.
Comment by Punter — Sun, Jan 27th, 2008 @ 7:35 pm
Punty:
“Oh, sorry. As a Finn you’re taught not to think but to follow the common line.”
Ah yes, the inevitable “Finns are stupid and smell bad”-argument. This will surely bring down the IPCC. There’s a Nobel price coming up! I wonder if this deep resentment you have for Finns affects your family life. Are you by any chance familiar with the work of Axel Olof Freudenthal?
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Mon, Jan 28th, 2008 @ 7:57 am
As I’ve mentioned before, my wife is a well traveled Finn who also spent time studying abroad. She has seen and learnt from various cultures and as a result looks and thinks in a very different way to many here. As a result, no my family life doesn’t suffer at all from my view of Finns nor from my view of Australians. We have an open and thoughtful family where we all think for ourselves and challenge the things we doubt.
As for the IPCC, watch the doc and then speak up for them. Just how many names listed in The IPCC really want to be there or contributed in a direct way?
Comment by Punter — Mon, Jan 28th, 2008 @ 5:07 pm
Punter:
“I’ve mentioned before, my wife is a well traveled Finn who also spent time studying abroad.”
Good for her, international experience is always useful. Do I need to mention that Finns are the most active participants in the ERASMUS program with 45,000 students being part of it between 1992 and 2007? ERASMUS accounts for roughly half of exchange students in higher education.
“We have an open and thoughtful family where we all think for ourselves and challenge the things we doubt.”
Oh, judging by your comments here, I’m sure that you have an open environment where everyone is encouraged to think independently, i.e. agree with Mr. Punter on everything or face the consequences, lest they be brainwashed mongolische untermenschen.
I’ll leech the documentary and provide my 0.02€ afterwards.
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Mon, Jan 28th, 2008 @ 10:39 pm
do so indeed. Just watch it with an open view and consider what is being said. You may like it or laugh at it but do watch it first.
BTW- Why is it always a survey or number to show how wonderful you Finns are? An ERASMUS this time? Maybe that just proves what so many of us here say in that your secondary and tertiary education standards are below par and therefore you go abroad to benefit. Wait, I’m sure there is another survey to disprove this one too…..
Comment by Punter — Tue, Jan 29th, 2008 @ 9:38 am
While waiting for my original comment to perhaps appear, I might add that the film does indeed raise two valid points:
1) The politicisation of science and the scavenging of funding (which might lead the most desperate to acquire it from ExxonMobile where the money trail probably leads to in case of this documentary as well)
2) Wrong priorities in starting the necessary infrastructure changes from the developing world. Peddlng solar panels to Africa is not the way to go. Their emissions are irrelevant. It is western industrialised nations and to an increasing degree also China and India that need to make changes.
And by the way, I confess to mentioning the ERASMUS stat just to get you all worked up. Your foaming at the mouth has great entertainment value.
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Tue, Jan 29th, 2008 @ 4:29 pm
Hope you enjoyed it
Comment by Punter — Tue, Jan 29th, 2008 @ 10:48 pm
Fascinating. I just can’t comment on this thread.
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Wed, Jan 30th, 2008 @ 12:00 am
Part 0: http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZYlbvJEZA_4
Part 1: http://youtube.com/watch?v=lIjGynF4qkE&watch_response
Part 2: http://youtube.com/watch?v=goDsc9IaSQ8&watch_response
Part 3: http://youtube.com/watch?v=yoyqFNCoDRY&watch_response
Part 4: http://youtube.com/watch?v=y5gUd6y3zKU&watch_response
Part 5: http://youtube.com/watch?v=SIsX5I6mVWo&watch_response
Part 6: http://youtube.com/watch?v=_RY_qEyHbj0&watch_response
Part 7: http://youtube.com/watch?v=YRnyHIheR0I&watch_response
Part 8: http://youtube.com/watch?v=I24QOvMUUyw&watch_response
Whoopee!
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Wed, Jan 30th, 2008 @ 12:03 am
Just the first part then:
Part 0: http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZYlbvJEZA_4
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Wed, Jan 30th, 2008 @ 12:05 am
I will have to say that ABC’s debate that I posted was a whole lot more entertaining than the little propaganda piece.
Do notice that the same documentarist proves us that silicone implants will rid the world of breast cancer.
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Wed, Jan 30th, 2008 @ 7:48 am
In case you’re wondering, there are about 5 posts where I tried to post that series sitting in Phil’s spam filter that seems to filter everything but spam. They’ll trickle here one of these weeks, I guess.
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Wed, Jan 30th, 2008 @ 9:44 am
Punter, which of the at least 4 versions of this documentary did you watch? The one I saw had Professor Wunsch’s part intact. I understood from the debate that this had been cut out from the Aussie version.
Eagerly awaiting comments from a fellow skeptic
Franky
Comment by Freeridin' Franklin — Wed, Jan 30th, 2008 @ 2:43 pm