Finland the most libertarian & second most leftist in EU?
According to PoliticalCompass.org (which offers a great test if you haven’t tried it already), Finland is the most libertarian country in the EU and the second most leftist country in the EU.
I took the test three times (results shown in the blue dots below) - once to represent the current sentiment in Finnish society, once as the sentiment in US society, and once as my own personal opinions…
Hat Tip to Thomas K. for the link!
A little bit “professional” version of that. This version on your blog is made by political journalist…
http://www.geert-hofstede.com/index.shtml
Comment by Heikki — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 12:35 pm
So, just to clarify, the “blue” Finland dot represents your taking of the test and your personal thinking of what “Finland” would answer?
Would that not just mean that it reflects and overexagerates your own opinions about Finnish society rather than reality? I meet a lot of Americans here and in Sweden who instantly tell me that “Scandinavia is socialist/communist” etc, when you ask them why they think this they often come out with the most strange reasons. One told me that it was because there was public transport that came on time. Admittedly, these are people who are just visiting - but even so.
How can the United States be more left wing than almost every EU country? Still, if that is a genuine reflection of sentiments there, perhaps the future will be brighter for the world after all. The problem is, I think it’s probably not the case.
Comment by JG — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 12:43 pm
Finland is a very leftist country,which is also falling into sphere of influence of Russian PUTINISM to the east..
Here in MOONBAT Massachusetts,the blue-est of the blue multi-culti politically correct states in the good ol’ U.S.A.,we have soaring taxes,illegal crimm-aliens sucking up our states resources,and a huge budget deficit re-developing..Many illegal crimm-aliens are calling for universal free health care, education,and demanding many new entitlements that the overtaxed citizens can not afford…Remember what Noam Chomsky,the virulent racist, bigot,anti semitic clown famously stated.”THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FREE LUNCH!
Comment by infinndel — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 3:17 pm
â€ÂTHERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A FREE LUNCH!
sure there is, you just tax and tax, and when the money stops flowing,
well thats the EU.
Comment by winter “Yea, Proton Power, now in remission†— Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 4:18 pm
“I took the test three times (results shown in the blue dots below) - once to represent the current sentiment in Finnish society, once as the sentiment in US society, and once as my own personal opinions…”
This tells us quite a bit. The substantial difference between your positioning of “the current sentiment in Finnish society” (what stunning chutzpah!) and the real thing probably explains why so much of this blog is full of crap - you haven’t understood much about Finland yet, even if you’ve lived here for a few years.
As a card-carrying Green and former Social Democrat with a drug-filled past and a mildly anarchist and anti-corporate streak, I (-7.25, -3.54) MIGHT just mesh with your half-baked categorising of “Finnish society”, but that leaves rather a lot of people who are considerably more authoritarian, business-minded and economically conservative. In case you hadn’t noticed, Kokoomus (the party of business) won the election…
Comment by Echelon Brandö — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 4:25 pm
“but that leaves rather a lot of people who are considerably more authoritarian, business-minded and economically conservative. In case you hadn’t noticed, Kokoomus (the party of business) won the election…”
Who is currently in power matters very little, it’s the learning institutions and offices of government that define whether a country tilts left or right. Finland leans dangerously Left.
Comment by Big Bubba — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 4:38 pm
It’s sunday, have a cookie and play some xbox
Comment by Keksi — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 4:39 pm
2. Just because you disagree with Noam Chomsky doesn’t automatically qualify him for every negative epithet you can imagine. How is he racist, for instance?
Comment by Kimmo W. — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 6:54 pm
All that graph shows is how utterly, incredibly, totally warped your view of Finland is. Its actually a far better method than any of the argumentation we’ve employed on here to show that - thanks!
Comment by Rich — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 7:15 pm
The test makers call General Pinochet an “ultimate free marketer” which shows how little *they* know.
Comment by Erik — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 8:06 pm
Btw, “There is no such thing as a free lunch” was Robert A. Heinlein, not Noam Chomsky. Chomsky would probably say that free lunches is all about creating an economic system where you can make somebody else pay.
Comment by Erik — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 8:11 pm
#10 excellent…thanks for pointing that out Erik
Comment by infinndel — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 8:26 pm
thank God I dont live in Sweden
Comment by uncle sam — Sun, Sep 30th, 2007 @ 10:50 pm
I would actually disagree with where you think the US stands on here, Phil. If you take a look at http://www.politicalcompass.org/usprimaries2007, you can clearly see that the centre of US politics is farther right and more “authoritarian” than where you place it, somewhere around where Poland is on this grid. I agree with the people who made the website. Someone who in the United States is seen as a Liberal is, in the European context, a moderate Conservative.
I also take offense to #2… if I weren’t too astounded at the numerous contradictions inherent in his statements (e.g. Finland’s leftism making it susceptible to Putinism; calling immigrants “illegal crimm-aliens” [sic] and in the same breath blaming someone else for being a “virulent racist” and a “bigot”; calling Noam Chomsky (a Jew who was severely affected as a child by antisemitism in New York) as an “anti semitic [sic] clown”), I might take the time to explain to him how wrong he is.
Comment by Thomas K. — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 12:00 am
Hej Thomas K… I agree with you in nr 14 100%… but just wanted to point out it’s comment 3 you are rightly taking offence to (and not my nr 2)
Comment by JG — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 2:47 am
Hmm… that’s weird. On my computer the numbering of posts is different. This post will be #15, yours #14, and my first #13. By my numbering system, the one I took offense to was #2. Strange.
Comment by Thomas K. — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 5:44 am
Big Bubba wrote:
“Finland leans dangerously Left.”
I guess that means that Sweden, Belgium and Austria lean “dangerously” left as well?
Comment by Ã…boy — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 11:20 am
#16: Frankly, I think it is a minor miracle that any of these four collapsoid wretches can stand up without serious buttressing and reinforcement. Still, given Finland’s precarious lean, I suppose it is hardly surprising that it should do so well in the PISA studies (groan).
Comment by Eetu Kenossa — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 11:38 am
Despite my very opposing view on the current official Finnish idea that peoples’ money matters (income, capital income, wealth) are to be used for tabloid and internet entertainment, I find my bubble in almost exactly the same place as the one for Finland.
Comment by Sirkuspelle — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 3:07 pm
Fins are mostly Kommies. More than any other in EU.
Comment by doggie — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 3:57 pm
So, why is the communist party not in parliament?
Comment by Kaislis — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 8:48 pm
@18: I mean the red bubble for Finland, not the one Phil added.
Comment by Sirkuspelle — Mon, Oct 1st, 2007 @ 9:05 pm
#13..I stand by every thing I stated in #2..I will NOT repeat my self.
I suggest you google on any thing I stated in #2.It is easy to discover
the info about what I have stated in #2…Go to work
Comment by infinndel — Tue, Oct 2nd, 2007 @ 12:39 am
#7..I stand by everything I have stated about Noam Chomsky in #2,and also add to that…Chimpsky is a disgrace to the academic world!
Comment by infinndel — Tue, Oct 2nd, 2007 @ 12:46 am
“So, why is the communist party not in parliament?”
Most Fins will not say they are Kommies, because communism=russianism in Finland during cold war. But communism is in the mind of many Fins. Just look at all the jealousies among Fins to someone who earns more or owns more.
Then look at how much power Fins give to government over their lives. Fins don’t want to be free, but instead for strong authority to rule over them. It takes all their money and decides for them how to live.
If this is not modern time communism, then what is?
Comment by doggie — Tue, Oct 2nd, 2007 @ 12:34 pm
Is this about where the EU populations stand, where people from the EU who took this test stand, where EU politicians in general stand or where EU governments stand?
Comment by Helsinkian — Tue, Oct 2nd, 2007 @ 7:17 pm
doggie seems to be the generation of increasing troll population on this blog
Yes i admit i’m one of them too.
Comment by Pdexter — Tue, Oct 2nd, 2007 @ 7:33 pm
*new gene
Comment by Pdexter — Tue, Oct 2nd, 2007 @ 7:34 pm
Oh, doggie, doggie… sit.
Please do us all a favor and get your ass “fixed” before it’s too late.
Comment by The Dude — Wed, Oct 3rd, 2007 @ 1:51 am
Interesting… the way you view the Finnish society, sure an accurate way of checking things out - what did you put on that “bottled-water” question?
Economic Left/Right: 0.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 0.36
for me according to that, so at least political compass agrees with me that I’m pretty much of a Centrist.
Comment by Mikael — Wed, Oct 3rd, 2007 @ 11:39 am
Btw - noticed that according to Political Compass Pope Benedict XVI is a leftist - I’m sure of that there are plenty of Catholics who are going to be absolutely delighted.
Comment by Mikael — Wed, Oct 3rd, 2007 @ 11:42 am
Once again some Americans seem to know a lot about communism, Finland and the connection between. Let’s educate our fellow Americans. Our system is something in between capitalism and communism. It is taking the best parts from both systems. Now pay attention, simple facts follow. Our system seems to be working better than yours. Health care, education, justice system etc works better than their counterparts in US of A. This is what every single finnish-american say when they come back to Finland. Some of them report that even the simple things (like paying bills) may be complicated in the US of A. If you don’t believe me, then talk to some finnish-americans who have experienced the life in both countries.
Comment by Miss South Carolina — Sat, Oct 6th, 2007 @ 4:47 pm
You mean like the overwhelming majority of them that have migrated to the US of A and are still living there? In facts as a population of a so called “developed” country, you would struggle to find another with such a lhigh level of population that left their homeland and settled elsewhere. I once read there are over a million people living abroad that consider themselves Finnish. Now in a country of 5 million, that means around 20% of what we have today are abroad. That to me says that maybe things are not as you might have us believe Miss South Carolina or then maybe the welfare state just can’t afford to take all of them back that want to come.
Comment by Punter — Sun, Oct 7th, 2007 @ 8:43 pm
# 33 Where do you get your facts mate?
http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/8Comparison.htm
Anyway talk to the Finns who have experienced life in both countries. Preferably to the ones who have taken their kids to both countries.
Most of the Europeans prefer to live in Europe these days, I think that says quite a lot.
Comment by Miss South Carolina — Mon, Oct 8th, 2007 @ 1:44 am
You’re using stats from the year 1991? Don’t waste my time like that please.
“You are the weakest link, goodbye”
As for Finnish population outside of Finland, look it up. Look at the Finnish communities worldwide and membership. It is a fact, most know this as a backward underdeveloped poor country and have not only moved away but are better for having done so.
Comment by Punter — Mon, Oct 8th, 2007 @ 6:03 pm
“You’re using stats from the year 1991? Don’t waste my time like that please.”
Waste your time? Wow. You really feel insulted. Atleast I give some stats to back my opinions, unlike you. Just how much you think the world has changed in 15 years? Show me stats that prove me wrong.
The only fact is that only the americans think EU countries as a backward underdeveloped poor countries. One german lad went to US and they asked him does europe have electricity yet. And they were serious.
Comment by Miss South Carolina — Mon, Oct 8th, 2007 @ 7:33 pm
And you think I’m American. And you’re serious. Investigate Finnish migration post 1950 and you’ll see the number of Finns that have moved from this place. Now look at returns and migration into Finland. Noice anything?
Christ I remember my ex’s family in my homeland even getting mail from Finland in the early 90’s tempting them to return to Finland. They had lived abroad 12 years and Finland was trying to return citizens to Finland, even offering to pay for flights and resettlement costs including training. How desperate. Needless to say, my ex’s family are still abroad and in no hurry to return to that “Socialist hell hole” as they put it. I really should have listende to them closer all those years ago.
BTW- I once heard of a Finn on a blog saying “most Americans don’t even know the 52 states of The Union” or something to that matter. Imagine what a fool. 52 States??? Gotta laugh except for all that tax money spent on education and they say “52 States…” ha ha ha
Comment by Punter — Mon, Oct 8th, 2007 @ 8:56 pm
Economic Left/Right: 2.62
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -2.87
Phil..we match little bit? I am a finn.
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