Comments on: Illegal pharmaceuticals and socialized healthcare http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/ Politics, current events, culture - From Finland & United States Wed, 07 Jan 2009 05:05:37 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.7 hourly 1 By: Pave http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336882 Pave Wed, 29 Aug 2007 16:13:45 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336882 There's no such thing as a free drug, winter. You paid them years ago through insurance fees. There’s no such thing as a free drug, winter. You paid them years ago through insurance fees.

]]> By: winter “Yea, Proton Power, now in remission” http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336761 winter “Yea, Proton Power, now in remission” Tue, 28 Aug 2007 11:05:05 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336761 What???? You don't have free drugs?????? So just where is your so called low cost medical system putting all that money? By the way, my drugs are free... Ha Ha Ha (I have overlapping coverage and have yet to pay for any drugs, even a co-pay this year) What???? You don’t have free drugs??????

So just where is your so called low cost medical system putting all that money?

By the way, my drugs are free… Ha Ha Ha (I have overlapping coverage and have yet to pay for any drugs, even a co-pay this year)

]]> By: Anna-Leena http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336755 Anna-Leena Tue, 28 Aug 2007 09:59:12 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336755 I don't see what these two things have together. Pharmaseuticals have never been free, neither are they supposed to be. If someone orders Viagra from the net, because he's embarrased to speak to a doctor about it, that's his right. If he's ready to take the risk of eating something else, that it says on the label, that's also his right. Public healtcare has nothing whatsoever to do with that. I don’t see what these two things have together. Pharmaseuticals have never been free, neither are they supposed to be. If someone orders Viagra from the net, because he’s embarrased to speak to a doctor about it, that’s his right. If he’s ready to take the risk of eating something else, that it says on the label, that’s also his right. Public healtcare has nothing whatsoever to do with that.

]]> By: Rita El Khoury http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336750 Rita El Khoury Tue, 28 Aug 2007 08:11:14 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336750 Well in Finland people buy drugs online, in Lebanon they buy them from pharmacies that give a 20% discount. With the official benefit of the pharmacist being 22.5%, you wonder how these pharmacies keep on with 20% discount while still paying electricity/phone bils, employees and taxes. Leaves you perplex. Still people rush there, and wait in lines, just to buy their drugs (most of the pharmacies just sell drugs, no question answering, no advice giving, NOTHING) And it makes you wonder why the phamacist job is becoming so despised nowadays! Anyway, you can never blame the drug companies for their pricings. Since every drug takes around 10 yrs of studies before release, and for every drug marketed there are like a 100 or more who failed the studies from the 1st, 2nd or 3rd phase, you understand why a new drug costs so much and why the generics are so low-cost. Well in Finland people buy drugs online, in Lebanon they buy them from pharmacies that give a 20% discount. With the official benefit of the pharmacist being 22.5%, you wonder how these pharmacies keep on with 20% discount while still paying electricity/phone bils, employees and taxes. Leaves you perplex. Still people rush there, and wait in lines, just to buy their drugs (most of the pharmacies just sell drugs, no question answering, no advice giving, NOTHING)
And it makes you wonder why the phamacist job is becoming so despised nowadays!
Anyway, you can never blame the drug companies for their pricings. Since every drug takes around 10 yrs of studies before release, and for every drug marketed there are like a 100 or more who failed the studies from the 1st, 2nd or 3rd phase, you understand why a new drug costs so much and why the generics are so low-cost.

]]> By: philtard http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336738 philtard Mon, 27 Aug 2007 23:22:22 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336738 #4 It does address, however I happen to know anti-depressants are far from simple prescription and you shouldn't experiement with them yourself. Also at least according to a story in City-magazine getting Viagra couldn't be simpler even for a guy under 30. Obesity can't be dealt with just pills. However I claim in most cases it can be dealt without pills entirely. I would also maintain that the high numbers of internet orders are because of the tendency of these groups (obese, impotent) to seek "miracle" cures. #4

It does address, however I happen to know anti-depressants are far from simple prescription and you shouldn’t experiement with them yourself.
Also at least according to a story in City-magazine getting Viagra couldn’t be simpler even for a guy under 30.

Obesity can’t be dealt with just pills. However I claim in most cases it can be dealt without pills entirely.
I would also maintain that the high numbers of internet orders are because of the tendency of these groups (obese, impotent) to seek “miracle” cures.

]]> By: Punter http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336729 Punter Mon, 27 Aug 2007 20:53:38 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336729 #3-"free up the system..... KELA would still only buy from partner pharmacies" NO, we mean FREE IT UP, not free it up Finnish style where we do so (in name anyway) but don't change a thing about it. #3-”free up the system….. KELA would still only buy from partner pharmacies”

NO, we mean FREE IT UP, not free it up Finnish style where we do so (in name anyway) but don’t change a thing about it.

]]> By: Freeridin' Franklin http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336719 Freeridin' Franklin Mon, 27 Aug 2007 19:47:06 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336719 #3: Most geniuses ordering online "Viagra" hardly suffer from erectile dysfunction (unless you count #3: Most geniuses ordering online “Viagra” hardly suffer from erectile dysfunction (unless you count

]]> By: DAVE THE RAVE http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336718 DAVE THE RAVE Mon, 27 Aug 2007 19:41:18 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336718 Philtard, what does the situation in the US have to do with this thread? Usually drugs bought on the internet cost MORE than they do in a pharmacy, if they don't they are very likely fake. What does a Finnish doctor say to a Finn who has trouble with his boners? Take a sauna? Philtard, what does the situation in the US have to do with this thread?

Usually drugs bought on the internet cost MORE than they do in a pharmacy, if they don’t they are very likely fake.

What does a Finnish doctor say to a Finn who has trouble with his boners? Take a sauna?

]]> By: Phil http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336714 Phil Mon, 27 Aug 2007 19:23:18 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336714 Shouldn't a proper socialized healthcare plan support erectile dysfunction, obesity, and depression? Shouldn’t a proper socialized healthcare plan support erectile dysfunction, obesity, and depression?

]]> By: philtard http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336713 philtard Mon, 27 Aug 2007 19:20:09 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336713 I don't really see the link to socialized health care here. The market of potency medication and slimming pills lies on the gullibility of the population. I think any good doctor in finland would rather recommend a combination of a new diet and excercise instead of any slimming medication. The potency medication is expensive because the big brand companies know they can ask almost anything for their product and it will sell. This naturally creates a pirate market very easily, this is a result of capitalism (patents, branding, ip-rights) rather than socialized healthcare. Now you could argue that the pharmacy business should be released in finland. However a likely scenario would be that Kela would still only subside drugs bought from certain "partner pharmacies" part of the public healthcare system. Also I strongly doubt counting out the Kela subsidies there'd be any decrease in prices even if there were more pharmacies. As for the drugs against harmful diseases it seems a poor US citizen is way more fucked over(and certainly trying to get theirs from the internet) than anyone living in scandinavia. I don’t really see the link to socialized health care here.
The market of potency medication and slimming pills lies on the gullibility of the population.

I think any good doctor in finland would rather recommend a combination of a new diet and excercise instead of any slimming medication.

The potency medication is expensive because the big brand companies know they can ask almost anything for their product and it will sell.
This naturally creates a pirate market very easily, this is a result of capitalism (patents, branding, ip-rights) rather than socialized healthcare.

Now you could argue that the pharmacy business should be released in finland. However a likely scenario would be that Kela would still only subside drugs bought from certain “partner pharmacies” part of the public healthcare system.
Also I strongly doubt counting out the Kela subsidies there’d be any decrease in prices even if there were more pharmacies.

As for the drugs against harmful diseases it seems a poor US citizen is way more fucked over(and certainly trying to get theirs from the internet) than anyone living in scandinavia.

]]> By: JG http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336712 JG Mon, 27 Aug 2007 19:01:52 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336712 I still don't understand. Presumably people going around stating that socialist welfare state medicine = bad, want this system to be abandoned in favour of the market controlling access to health care. Under such a system, do you just allow people to suffer who can not afford the market rate? I just fail to comprehend. It seems a very inhumane point of view. I still don’t understand. Presumably people going around stating that socialist welfare state medicine = bad, want this system to be abandoned in favour of the market controlling access to health care. Under such a system, do you just allow people to suffer who can not afford the market rate? I just fail to comprehend. It seems a very inhumane point of view.

]]> By: DAVE THE RAVE http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/comment-page-1/#comment-336711 DAVE THE RAVE Mon, 27 Aug 2007 18:56:55 +0000 http://www.finlandforthought.net/2007/08/27/illegal-pharmaceuticals-and-socialized-healthcare/#comment-336711 FROM THE HS ARTICLE (LINKED ABOVE) "" "Such e-mails come mainly from enterprises with no proper licence. I myself would never risk my health by buying medicines from the Internet", said Suvi-Anne Siimes, the General Director of Pharma Industry Finland. """ Of course she wouldn't risk it. She can afford it. She's a former parliamentarian and at the head of a pharmaceutical conglomerate. However, it should be underscored that the most pirated/illegal drugs ordered here are mostly "life-enhancing" drugs. I mean you won't die without a proper erection or with a few unsightly rolls of fat, will you. As for the antidepressants, I can only guess that for a "Real Finn" the stigma of admitting to depression might be too much, and either they turn to Kossu or to illicit (anonymous) drugs from the Internet. FROM THE HS ARTICLE (LINKED ABOVE) “” “Such e-mails come mainly from enterprises with no proper licence. I myself would never risk my health by buying medicines from the Internet”, said Suvi-Anne Siimes, the General Director of Pharma Industry Finland. “”"

Of course she wouldn’t risk it. She can afford it. She’s a former parliamentarian and at the head of a pharmaceutical conglomerate.

However, it should be underscored that the most pirated/illegal drugs ordered here are mostly “life-enhancing” drugs. I mean you won’t die without a proper erection or with a few unsightly rolls of fat, will you.

As for the antidepressants, I can only guess that for a “Real Finn” the stigma of admitting to depression might be too much, and either they turn to Kossu or to illicit (anonymous) drugs from the Internet.

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