Big Brother’s success in Finland vs. the U.S.
If you didn’t know all ready, the tv-show “Big Brother” is HUGE in Finland. It comes on like six (?) days a week I believe, even if you don’t watch the show you know what’s going on thanks to media coverage and discussions around the coffee machine (you can even get Finnish Big Brother news in English). Now in the states it’s a different story, I couldn’t find the ratings but it just hasn’t had the same impact as it has in Finland.
So I was trying to figure out why the same show is big in Finland but not in the states. For one thing, in Finland the viewers get to vote out the houseguests, while in the states the houseguests themselves do the voting (probably cause SMS isn’t nearly as popular in the states). And the U.S. has a lot more reality shows to compete. But I think it’s stereotypical Finnish characteristics and Finland’s homogeneousness that make this particular show so popular.
When I watch an American reality show, I can’t really relate with those people - they’re just actors from far-off locations and have little in common with me. I don’t care about them so I wouldn’t want to spend an hour of my day watching them muck around a house. But in Finland, the cast are from near-by towns that you’ve probably visited, and being a homogeneous society, there’s a lot more characteristics that you and the cast share. And I think there’s this Finnish instinct to spy on other people’s lives, especially your neighbors. The whole Nordic welfare state model is kinda a “big brother” (well more of a “nanny”), so naturally the show would fit right in. (Although the states is turning into a REAL big brother society each year)
Oh and there’s a lot more nudity and sex compared to the US version, that has to boost ratings.
So if it’s a (stereo)typically Finnish instinct to spy on your neighbors, then how come the programme is wildly popular all over the world? I believe that in Great Britain it is already on its sixth or seventh season and all contestants become instant celebrities. Let us also not forget its country of origin, The Netherlands, where the show is still going strong. And if you want sex on Big Brother, well go to Sweden and Norway. They don’t even bother doing it under the covers, or so I’m told.
Wasn’t the official showcase of whoredom, Temptation Island, a US invention? And a wildly popular one over there, too? So is it, like, a typically American thing to want to watch in glee as couples are split up by scheming man-whores and sluts?
So if the Finnish version contains more nudity and sex than the US version, I’m guessing that the US version is shot in a monastery or convent? Because personally I cannot think of a more boring programme than Big Brother.
Comment by Anzi — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 3:57 pm
So if it’s a (stereo)typically Finnish instinct to spy on your neighbors, then how come the programme is wildly popular all over the world?
Dunno, maybe sticking noses into neighbor’s lives is also a trait in other countries?
Because personally I cannot think of a more boring programme than Big Brother.
I completely agree! I wish my girlfriend thought the same
Comment by Phil — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 4:00 pm
Dunno, maybe sticking noses into neighbor’s lives is also a trait in other countries?
Like, a human trait you mean? Shocker of schockers! Is this why tabloid journalism exists? I have seen the light!
I completely agree! I wish my girlfriend thought the same
Thank you! Thank god my boyfriend agrees with me. That programme is the snorefest to end all snorefests. The contestants are all despicable idiots who should be committed.
Comment by Anzi — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 4:06 pm
It’s human nature to be a voyeur. People can be voyeurs without breaking any laws. People are also sensation-horny, and love reading gossip. In Belgium this dumb-ass program is really popular, and I ask myself why? Why in God’s name does anyone wants to see a bunch of retards who have no self-respect in a house do stupid things and act like monkeys? It’s beyond me…
Comment by David — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 4:14 pm
Big Brother tv show is massively popular all around the world, in countries such diverse as Australia, Argentina and the Netherlands. The main reason with this particular format being not as popular in United States is that there the market is saturated with so many other reality tv shows that this one loses some of its viewer base.
It’s also true that if you can relate with the contestants you will be more interested in the show. Has anyone considered running US Big Brother shows on regional basis? That is, own one for each state or maybe metropolitan area. That way you wouldn’t have to be bored with folks from far away places.
Comment by s. tanger — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 5:29 pm
Phil wrote: If you didn’t know all ready, the tv-show “Big Brother†is HUGE in Finland.
It isn’t, really. If you look at the weekly ratings, “Big Brother” is indeed the most popular show on Subtv, but it would be outside the top ten on Yle1 and Yle2 and outside the top twenty on MTV3. In other words, it isn’t among the 40 most viewed programs. Its absolute ratings might look high to an American, but Finnish TV ratings in general are higher than Americans due to less audience fragmentation.
Comment by a lamb with no guiding light — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 5:39 pm
Aside from seeing advertisements and knowing the premise, I’ve never actually watched the entire show. No loss, I’m sure.
But, I agree entirely with Phil’s premise that Finland is like a big brother (or nanny) state, wherein it is assumed that personal freedom is not really necessary. Consider this recent happening:
We received a request for a routine inspection of our premises; it’s required since we live in a multi-unit housing complex, and its aim is to prevent unexpected water damage. Perfectly legitimate. However, WE NEVER AGREED TO THE INSPECTION, neither in writing nor verbally.
Nevertheless the management company ASSUMED IT HAD PERMISSION TO ENTER OUR HOME. We were awakened by the door opening. In my early-morning grogginess, I ran toward the entranceway with the nearest thing I could find: A sharp kitchen knife from a previous night’s dinner plate.
Luckily, the guy, who was now standing in my foyer, was able to explain himself quickly enough to avoid serious injury………although, I think he shit in his pants as he jumped back a few steps.
Understand, I don’t question their motives of inspecting the flat, but I question their ASSUMPTION that they can do it without either implied or expressed permission. Instead, they just figured, since we didn’t reply after the first notice, it’s ok to go ahead and enter our home.
It’s only a small example. But we can easily extrapolate to make further inferences about our society, its norms and regulations. I won’t say it’s all bad and sinister, but generally speaking, Phil is right_on!
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 6:20 pm
I think it was even more huge in the UK (where they created the format?) and Sweden. And they have even a whole lot more nudity and sex than this years finnish big brother
Comment by Keksi — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 7:55 pm
Actually the American version of Big Brother did originally start with the public voting in its first season, and the voting public chose to shoot itself in the foot by voting out all the interesting players and thus, the ratings tanked. In the second and subsequent seasons they changed it to ’survivor’-style evictions where they vote each other out.
Also, the American Big Brother actually does have quite a large, loyal following. It’s only broadcast during the summer months, which may help ratings out. Although the most recent season did show some signs of slipping in the ratings, for seasons 2-6 each of the 3 weekly shows usually broke the top 20 if not the top 10 Nielsen’s ratings for the week.
I think the conservative nature of BB USA comes from the conservative nature of the US itself, really.
Comment by Wogger — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 8:10 pm
I like this BigBrother-show. I watch it every night when i am trying to get some sleep.
Comment by Jyväskyläinen — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 9:07 pm
I thought the term “little brother” was pretty established, but I have never seen it in these discussions, apparently I was wrong. “little brother” being when you are spied by your peers and neighbors, while “big brother” is when you are peered by the government, or someone else with authority.
Carry on.
Comment by iJusten — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 10:18 pm
I hate the program. I have never watched it. I have only watched bits and pieces while channel surfing and I don’t understand those who can actually watch this piece of crap. The characters are absolutely despicable.
Comment by Mikko Sandt — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 10:34 pm
Like, a human trait you mean? Shocker of schockers! Is this why tabloid journalism exists? I have seen the light!
And tabloid journalism is much much bigger in Finland than the states.
Comment by Phil — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 11:12 pm
Oh and there’s a lot more nudity and sex compared to the US version, that has to boost ratings.
I don’t think nudity is such a taboo in Finland anyone would pay half attention to it as something extra. Maybe in some other more prudish countries that would be the case.
Comment by Hank W. — Tue, Nov 28th, 2006 @ 11:46 pm
Phil wrote: And tabloid journalism is much much bigger in Finland than the states.
Journalism in general is much, much bigger in Finland than in United States. On a per capita basis, compared to Americans Finns buy about twice as many newspapers.
Comment by a lamb with no guiding light — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 12:00 am
Its absolute ratings might look high to an American, but Finnish TV ratings in general are higher than Americans due to less audience fragmentation.
Put another way, Finnish TV sucks and there’s never anything good on, so people just watch whatever stupid crap they can.
Comment by saempy — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 12:54 am
The whole Nordic welfare state model is kinda a “big brother†(well more of a “nannyâ€Â), so naturally the show would fit right in. (Although the states is turning into a REAL big brother society each year)
Just look at how our tax records, in Finland, are public information. If that’s not REAL big brother, then I don’t know what is. Seriously, if we can’t get this resolved on our own, then I would totally favor some EU intervention to standardize privacy issues, such as this.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 12:55 am
@Kristian:
Really? I would have even called it transparency. And it’s just a guess, but tax records probably are public information in most EU countries. (Although I admit that the Veropörssi and tabloid tossings they stir up here somehow sound quite Finnish phenomena.)
But what’s the worry, actually? If I’ve got it right, you’d like to overhaul our tax system. Aren’t the open tax data then a perfect proof to underline the prevailing problems -that labour is taxed harshly in Finland, capital and corporates modestly, and that, say, the property tax is the lowest in EU15.
The sooner the people will start to discuss it, the sooner it can be changed. So let’s keep these things open, the rich aren’t shy.
Comment by Aapo — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 1:40 am
Sure, we can look at all those things to see where improvements can be made. And we can look at tax data as part of that process. But, why can’t the information be anonymous? Why does my name or yours need to be associated with the number? Does the name provide value to our economic analysis?
Of course not; it provides absolutely no value. But, from a privacy perspective it DOES make a difference to us as individuals. There is no reason why you should see my personal financial data, unless I give you my expressed permission. And there’s no reason why I should see yours.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 2:24 am
#19 was a reply to Aapo #18.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 2:25 am
And tabloid journalism is much much bigger in Finland than the states.
Really? We only have Ilta-Sanomat, Iltalehti, and Seiska. The Americans have Celebrity Skin magazine, The National Enquirer, E! Entertainment (doesn’t it have an entire TV-channel?), People, World News Weekly…. What else? The Fox network!
Comment by Anzi — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 8:32 am
@16,
some of us have given up. If the Big Brother is the best thing available, there’s no excuse to watch TV.
Comment by prince of dorkness — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 8:51 am
I HATE big brother, and pretty much all reality TV. But I think your analysis is spot on.
Comment by Krisu — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 9:01 am
10. I like this BigBrother-show. I watch it every night when i am trying to get some sleep.
This is true. It’s on at such a convenient time on weekdays, it acts as a very effective sopoforic. But then Conan wakes me back up again if I don’t turn the TV off in time.
-BM
Comment by Badgermushroom — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 9:12 am
Put another way, Finnish TV sucks and there’s never anything good on, so people just watch whatever stupid crap they can.
That’s not true. I watch at least one programme every day of the week except Wednesdays and Saturdays. If BB wouldn’t exist, I wouldn’t miss it.
Reality TV does suck, except for America’s Next Top Model. But that’s just because I’m a twisted chick.
Comment by Anzi — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 10:29 am
What? 25 comments so far and no one has mentioned Russia or potential threats from Russia yet? C’mon guys!
Comment by Alex — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 11:01 am
Anzi doesn’t watch Deadwood? Shame on you!
That show is interesting for political theory even.
Comment by Pave — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 12:53 pm
@Kristian: Now that I did some searching, the openness of Finnish tax data seems to be quite extensive. At least Denmark and Sweden publish theirs more moderately. But I still can’t see the worry. If some twats want to spy then let them, if it makes their lives interesting.
In general. To me it seems that Phil, regarding this one, suffers from the same ill as sociology freshmen -that absolutely everything should be explained by society and social context. And even if it maybe shouldn’t, it sounds cool anyway.
Can you really, seriously, claim that reality shows tend to make it big only in homogenous countries? Somehow it doesn’t sound too convincing if you have a look around, and this time not only Finland or USA.
And our tabloids are shamefully lame if you compare with the yellow press e.g. in Britain. This should be rather obvious to everyone who’s able to read.
Speaking of Britons, who could be Finland’s George Galloway? I don’t own a tv so I’ve never watched Big Brother either. But I might get one if they bring some SDP backbencher there and make him to purr like a cat.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/4608082.stm
Comment by Aapo — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 1:13 pm
I missed the first season of Deadwood because I was abroad so I haven’t gotten into the second one, either. I’d probably like it, though.
I also don’t watch Lost or Grey’s Anatomy or CSI (any of them) but that’s just because I couldn’t care less about the premises of those shows.
Comment by Anzi — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 1:14 pm
“..no one has mentioned Russia or potential threats from Russia yet?..”
Noo, we are the bad guys now. With any set of initial values, the trajectory of discussion is very prone to stuck on attractor characterized by flag waving, Hizbollah shielding and some strange plot to tap into Iran oil resources.
Comment by antti (the redneck one) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 1:19 pm
Sarppa
Hei Phil, could you try if you are able to write here for one week without mentioning welfare state? It gets so boring, when you have to stuff it to e-ve-ry-thing.
I don’t remember seeing much nudity in BB, even Hanne and Olli were so prudishly under covers all the time.
Comment by Kaislis — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 1:37 pm
Hey, why that smiley?!?!?!? : x usually make a kiss or a heart!!!
Comment by Kaislis — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 1:39 pm
Can you really, seriously, claim that reality shows tend to make it big only in homogenous countries? Somehow it doesn’t sound too convincing if you have a look around, and this time not only Finland or USA.
I don’t think anyone is making that claim. I’m talking about Big Brother specifically, not reality shows in general.
Comment by Phil — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 2:40 pm
I don’t think anyone is making that claim. I’m talking about Big Brother specifically, not reality shows in general.
This doesn’t make any sense either.
We’ve already established that Big Brother is even raunchier, way more popular, and more raw in its peeping Tom -qualities in several other countries. It has also run for a lot longer in those countries than it has in Finland, where it is only on its second season.
Personally I think that BB is actually a very atypical Finnish show which does not fit well into the Finnish mindset. It forces people to be social, to talk a lot, be on display, and interact in close quarters with complete strangers. Nothing particularly Finnish about that, IMO.
Comment by Anzi — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 3:32 pm
Aapo:
Now that I did some searching, the openness of Finnish tax data seems to be quite extensive. At least Denmark and Sweden publish theirs more moderately. But I still can’t see the worry. If some twats want to spy then let them, if it makes their lives interesting.
Unfortunately, it has greater implications than just making some snoop’s life more interesting. It’s really an infringement on privacy to avail private information to the public. Perhaps I don’t mind if YOURS is available for all to see, but I don’t want—nor can I have—MINE out there.
As I mentioned before, I’m very much in-favor of EU regulations to guard private data. I’m looking into ways that it can be done, and I won’t rule-out going to court.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 4:21 pm
#35
Oh, and another thing…. Here in Finland, not only does your nosy neighbor have access to your private data, anyone in the world can access it.
We are very naive here in Finland.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 7:15 pm
I don;t think that it is because of the reason you stated I think the show is just bad on the whole and that the name itself turns many Americans off. I don’t think its because they are some far off character, because we watch MTV’s Real World and the idea is almost similar. The problem with the show is that unlike Real World they put you in situations to make you do dumb things like on Finnish Big Brother they are constantly giving them alcohol even when they have done nothing do deserve it in order to make them more entertaining. Whereas on Real World if they went out to get drunk or cause chaos it was them just doing what they normally do.I think you are right on why it is hugely popular here though and that is because these people are tangible and you know someone that is like the person on that show. The nudity I don’t think is as much as a factor here as it would be in say Sweden or Poland where they are having sex and it is in the open where here it always hidden and the nudity is mainly on guys then it is on the girls.
Comment by Kourtney Williams — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 7:28 pm
#36
Moscow, Kiev, Tel-Aviv, Abuja, Mogadishu…… People in those cities all have access your private data, that our government publicizes here in Finland.
Very naive.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 7:29 pm
wtf? People actually watch that crap?
I have this feeling that I want to call as ‘humanity disgrace’, this show and people admitting that they actually watch it brings up that feeling.
Its a feeling where you like to move into Mars, or everywhere else where you wouldnt have to feel shame for the other people.
Comment by xd — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 7:33 pm
Kristian: I’ve found it rather useful, for example, to read from papers which kind of salaries my hockey team paid for our players and who was worth the money. But maybe that’s never been an issue in Espoo hockey?
Oh well, there are quite many things that someone, usually big, would always regard as none of your business so I just prefer to opt for transparency. Keep in your mind how also MTK wanted to keep the farm subsidies in secret, and did we find from there…
Of course I don’t find it extremely necessary that people can check my tax records by SMS, but I guess the worst thing to happen is that I have a date with a hot chick, which after she checks my earnings at home and judges me entirely unsuitable to take care of her would-be offsprings and says basta grazie. So maybe it’s not the most accute threat to my civic liberties, after all.
Besides, in the tax records case I can know what information there is about me and who can access it. I’d be a bit more worried of data that is collected but of which I’ve no idea how it can be used -for example by hackers, if not authorities themselves. Have you been following the British ID debate?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/6120220.stm
Comment by Aapo — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 8:35 pm
@40 “what did we find from there”, even. You got my point anyway.
Comment by Aapo — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 8:36 pm
#38
So, let’s see…. If you are Finnish, then someone in Nigeria or Somalia can know all about your income, your investments, who is your employer, your home address, the address of your summer cabin, your wife’s name, your children’s names, their ages.
Transparency, very nice.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 8:49 pm
.
Comment by Anonymous — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 8:52 pm
#38
So, let’s say that a recent Finnish citizen—one who is of Russian, Nigerian or Somalian descent—invites friends from his home-country to visit him, here in Finland…..
They sit in his living room, in front of the computer, and page-through your tax records. Now they know:
your KELA number;
your employer;
your salary;
your investments;
your wife’s name;
your kids names and their ages;
and the address of your summer cabin.
Transparency, very nicely done Finland. Tyhmästi tehty Suomi.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Nov 29th, 2006 @ 10:07 pm
#13 That’s only because the target ‘audience’ in the US can’t read
Comment by aet75 — Thu, Nov 30th, 2006 @ 5:55 pm
Finnish transparency turning into the preferred source of info for 419 scams! Who would have thought?
Comment by Martin-Éric — Sat, Dec 2nd, 2006 @ 1:49 am
what ever! PIRPANA RULES!
Comment by pepe — Sat, Dec 2nd, 2006 @ 6:12 am
#46 That’s right Martin-Eric, julkiset verotiedot makes Finns look like foolish clowns to the rest of the world.
Just think, a Finn goes on vacation in Spain, Greece or whereever, and some cheesy hotel clerk pushes a few buttons on his mobile phone. Then he knows everything about the Finn’s earnings and financial worth.
Finns are morons for letting the government publish their personal financial records so the world can see. Even those in Africa can see Finn’s personal financial information.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Sat, Dec 2nd, 2006 @ 8:45 am
#48
So fucking what. Are you affraid that the “evil” foreigners will come and eat you. Seriously they have no use of that information and if they’re going to huzzle you they are going to do it even if they don’t know what you pay in taxes.
Comment by Anonymous — Sat, Dec 2nd, 2006 @ 12:33 pm
Let’s see….. The Finnish business owner goes to a foreign country to negotiate a work contract, so that his employees here in Finland can remain employed for the next 12-months.
His prospective foreign customer, with whom he is negotiating said contract, presses a few buttons on his mobile phone. Within seconds, the foreigner will know how much the Finn earns, his financial worth and his debts. Now he knows exactly how badly the Finn wants (or needs!) that contract.
It’s sort of like a game of Poker. And the Finn has drunkenly displayed all of his cards in advance. It fits our naive and foolish reputation very well.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Sat, Dec 2nd, 2006 @ 5:27 pm
yeah maybe in the karvahattu era. that still doesnt give them well anykind of advantage unless they are complete idiots, then it’s a diffrent thing.
Comment by Anonymous — Sun, Dec 3rd, 2006 @ 12:42 am
Post 15 … “Journalism in general is much, much bigger in Finland than in United States. On a per capita basis, compared to Americans Finns buy about twice as many newspapers.”
Twisted Fact. To say that journalism is found in only in newspapers is extremely naive. In the U.S. newspaper ciculations are down as alternitive choices increase. Our choices are going from the hundreds to the thousands. Newspapers are to far behind. Who wants to read news that’s 24 hours old?
It’s unfortunate that Finland does not have such a multitude of choices. There’s very few actually. With less choices, the news disseminators have more power on what to report and how to report it. They don’t have to worry about opposing viewpoints.
A Finns only option is to learn English and install a high speed internet connection.
Comment by Anonymous — Sun, Dec 3rd, 2006 @ 1:44 am