So the US and Europe should bomb London when UK muslim extremists decide to blow up the Piccadilly line. Or what?

The problems lie in their own countries, starting with a lack of any real education.

That’s certainly true when the terrorists happen to come from the US, and probably the UK as well.

“Looking through the eyeglass of history, 9/11 was an isolated incident; USA’s repeated assaults on Asian and Middle-Eastern soil was not.”

- Hmmm, you have a short memory. 9/11 was a follow-up attack for the ’93 bombing. (And what was the reason for that attack?)

There has been a boatload of ‘isolated’ incidents.

– USS COLE bombing
– USS THE SULLIVANS (Failed bombing. Bomber’s boat sank)
– Iraq invading Kuwait
– Iran storming the US Embassy
– Hezbollah bombing the US Marine Baracks in Lebanon
– 1993 World Trade Center bombing
– TWA Bombing
– Shoe bomber
– Africa Embassy bombings
– London metro bombings
– Spain train bombings
– Attempted train bombings in Germany
– Bali bombings

Just to name a few. The problem is not US and European policy, other than it is too soft on the Governments where these people come from. The problems lie in their own countries, starting with a lack of any real education.

– Even with all the ‘oppression’ it is the Muslims (born and converted) that do the lion’s share of terror acts. (Note: I did not say arabs. I said Muslims. I do not care what the color of their skin is.)

“I’m afraid that some of them might give up waiting for the paranoia to stop and take matters into their own hands. I really don’t want to be here the day they do.”

– Are you suggesting that the gypsies in Finland might start some sort of insurgency? There is no money in it for them to strap explosives to their body and board the 3T tram during rush hour. Half of their complaints are probably just a way to extort more money out of the social welfare system.

– In the US, we have millions of illegal aliens roaming around with no fear of the FBI and police. It is Europe that is hassling these groups of their own initiative. The US cares little about them as they are not a threat. (to the US.) Anyway, it is the job of the border Guards, immigration and the police to be suspicious. They might treat westerners differently, but I suspect that is more due to experience than racism. News is also out that Muslims are moving to the US in record numbers. Hardly a sign of oppression.

Appeasement will get you nowhere, except perhaps on a slab. The police should be able to investigate where the leads take them. After all, that’s their job.

The fact is that the stepped-up security precautions, – especially the FBI interview of some 5000 Muslim immigrants in the US, on a completely arbitrary basis – sent the right kind of message. I find it very astounding that we’ve had no successful terrorist cases in the US since 9/11, given the demonization of the US throughout the world.

The real problem in the US are not Muslim immigrants, but possible anti-American European terrorists. Europe, after all, is a major incubator for terrorists, given the refugee status so many terrorists are accorded, and the pass terrorism is granted if it suits European ideologies.

There are also ethnic EU minorities such as Baltic Slavs and Gypsies that their local governments consider as foreigners and systematically try to deport, westerners who routinely face increasingly intrusive scrutiny simply because they are not EU nationals, etc. Westerners usually have the option to simply go home. For the others, THIS has always been their home. They are victims of paranoia in their homeland and are growing increasingly tired of the blatant violations of their rights. I’m afraid that some of them might give up waiting for the paranoia to stop and take matters into their own hands. I really don’t want to be here the day they do.

The best course of action is to admit that the border guards, the Immigration and the police all have their share of blame in feeding the racist and xenophobic paranoia in Finland, then to do something about educating them and about getting rid of the worst paranoia feeders in their ranks.

“One should also remember that while Finland did not send any troops in Iraq, it however contributed exactly two police officers to the multinational group training the new Iraqi police force. This fact alone might be enough to get Finland labeled as a willing partner in USA’s war mongering campain.”

That’s nothing. The Finland terror risk report had cases of muslim imans in Finland reporting that word was in the community that Finns participated in the crusades. Try and undo that. The report also cited that actions mean nothing as they will find an excuse if they decide to attack you.

One should also remember that while Finland did not send any troops in Iraq, it however contributed exactly two police officers to the multinational group training the new Iraqi police force. This fact alone might be enough to get Finland labeled as a willing partner in USA’s war mongering campain.

On the public security awareness, of course it is not high in Finland. In London, the writing has been on the tube station wall for what? 40 years telling people to be a lert (sic!) and report the unattended bags etc. In Finland there has been no need for that simply for the reason there hasn’t been any IRA bomb campaigns. I refuse to be alert and afraid, until there is some real reason. There is enough government kyykkyyn-ylös in this country already.

I can’t imagine any non-Finns could carry out training exercises beyond the most facile here without being noticed let alone a group of say, beared British-pakistani boys.

I don’t know that Finns wouldn’t notice a few dark-skinned people running around with guns, but recruiting is certainly a possibility here given the small number and their minority status here. If SUPO can’t assess the threat of a bunch of kids with sticks and have the appropriately non-hysterical response it makes me wonder what would happen in the case of a real terrorism threat here.

I will try to keep this posting short. I have a friend who is a security consultant in a well known Finnish based firm which I will not mention here to protect the identity of this individual and his company. Anyway, his company conducted a series of security audits in Helsinki around christmas last year. It involved leaving a bobby trapped bag in a public area and waiting for someone to open it, to gauge the responce/awareness of the average finnish public. As no big surprise the target bag was alone for a long while without any interference even when placed in the railway station which I thought was very surprising. The booby trap was a mild indoor firework which made a bang when a fuse was pulled. In the study apparently it showed that the elderly or older generation were the most likely to investigate and open an unattended bag. This study was commissioned by a governemnt agency I believe, so its very possible an exact report can be found on the web about the word-for-word findings.

But this does show that the threat assessments are being made. And also that other cities apart from Helsinki are high on the target list for possible “terrorist” targets. but the most important comment i thought my friend made was that Finland’s biggest danger was its role as a European training ground for terror cells. Finnish people in general do not have a high security awareness factor such as in ireland, UK, Spain for example. Where the public call the bomb squad to blow up unattended bags at railway stations for example. Causing huge delays and diversions to everyone else, also a weapon of the terrorist.

Training exercises would in large go un-noticed in finland. Unless a building or a body count was involved. From Finland a traveller has virtually unlimited access to Europe and largely without any papers being required.

As a disclaimer, this posting is ofcourse my own interpretation of “my friends” first hand knowledge of the tasks, so any incorrect or not fully detailed points are totally up to the reader to interpret, and judge. I accept no responsibility for wrongly labelled F-16′s, locations in Finland, or any other flame war-able/quote-able items.

On subject of the Finnish jihadists, I suspect they are in line with our modern times radicals, such as taistoites; a heck of a noise, but no revolution.

I hope though, that the part of the Finnish “intelligentsiya” with totalitarian preferences doesn’t bump into radical islam.

Highest probability is that the writer doesn’t know their ass from their elbow… Or using logic, as F-18 is mainly a Navy plane on Aircraft carriers, so Finland like has land fighters… or then not.

Then again it isn’t the first time in Finnish Air Force history they’ve used US Navy fighters, last time with quite some success.