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	<title>Comments on: Police State Finland?</title>
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	<description>Politics, current events, culture - From Finland &#38; United States</description>
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		<title>By: Markku</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-90602</link>
		<dc:creator>Markku</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Sep 2006 05:53:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-90602</guid>
		<description>A couple of stories by arrested citizen (in Finnish, sorry):

http://viima.vuodatus.net/blog/235723?showcomments=yes

http://klubitus.org/forum_aihe.php?id=51330;pid=824754#824754

I think it&#039;s obvious that the Finnish constitution has been violated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A couple of stories by arrested citizen (in Finnish, sorry):</p>
<p><a href="http://viima.vuodatus.net/blog/235723?showcomments=yes" rel="nofollow">http://viima.vuodatus.net/blog/235723?showcomments=yes</a></p>
<p><a href="http://klubitus.org/forum_aihe.php?id=51330;pid=824754#824754" rel="nofollow">http://klubitus.org/forum_aihe.php?id=51330;pid=824754#824754</a></p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s obvious that the Finnish constitution has been violated.</p>
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		<title>By: Kimmo W.</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-90225</link>
		<dc:creator>Kimmo W.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 20:19:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-90225</guid>
		<description>Having had better things to do while all the shit was coming down on Mannerheimintie last Saturday, I was not there, and therefore, I cannot pretend to have an informed opinion on who was right and who was wrong. (It seems like quite a few others in my position had their minds made up very quickly on whom to blame).

Certainly, the pseudo-anarchist organisers were &quot;asking for it&quot;, but from what I can tell, the police response did seem to be rather heavy-handed.

While I do not subscribe to the thoughts of the extreme ends of the issue (I do see the human beings who comprise the police force as neither inherenty evil nor inherently virtuous), on the basis of what I have seen and heard in the media, the events of the night in question certainly merit at least some kind of investigation. Parliametnary Ombudsman, go for it!

Anyway, I understand that this coming Saturday, there will be a demonstration again in front of Kiasma at 17:45 called &quot;Joku raja 
Rajamäki&quot; demo for anyone who might be interested.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Having had better things to do while all the shit was coming down on Mannerheimintie last Saturday, I was not there, and therefore, I cannot pretend to have an informed opinion on who was right and who was wrong. (It seems like quite a few others in my position had their minds made up very quickly on whom to blame).</p>
<p>Certainly, the pseudo-anarchist organisers were &#8220;asking for it&#8221;, but from what I can tell, the police response did seem to be rather heavy-handed.</p>
<p>While I do not subscribe to the thoughts of the extreme ends of the issue (I do see the human beings who comprise the police force as neither inherenty evil nor inherently virtuous), on the basis of what I have seen and heard in the media, the events of the night in question certainly merit at least some kind of investigation. Parliametnary Ombudsman, go for it!</p>
<p>Anyway, I understand that this coming Saturday, there will be a demonstration again in front of Kiasma at 17:45 called &#8220;Joku raja<br />
Rajamäki&#8221; demo for anyone who might be interested.</p>
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		<title>By: Olli</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-90041</link>
		<dc:creator>Olli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 16:42:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-90041</guid>
		<description>And you conveniently dismissed the fact that you still don&#039;t have a case as you and your left wing friends have completely failed to convince me of the police&#039;s misconduct. In fact, you haven&#039;t given a single argument which I haven&#039;t been able to refute with great ease.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And you conveniently dismissed the fact that you still don&#8217;t have a case as you and your left wing friends have completely failed to convince me of the police&#8217;s misconduct. In fact, you haven&#8217;t given a single argument which I haven&#8217;t been able to refute with great ease.</p>
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		<title>By: Anonymous</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-90033</link>
		<dc:creator>Anonymous</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 16:21:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-90033</guid>
		<description>And you conviniently dismissed the fact that your right winger friends in the parliament support the police fully, the left being the only party who opposed the case.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And you conviniently dismissed the fact that your right winger friends in the parliament support the police fully, the left being the only party who opposed the case.</p>
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		<title>By: Olli</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89946</link>
		<dc:creator>Olli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 13:46:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89946</guid>
		<description>&quot;Perhaps from the fact that innocent bystanders donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t smash windows and generally follow verbal instructions by the authorities in a crisis situation?&quot;

And exactly how should they do that? If the police are scattered around the general area where the anarchist are, there is no way they can do their job effectively. There really is a reason why the riot police works as large team and not as individuals. When it comes to the police chasing window-breaking criminals, the police has already failed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Perhaps from the fact that innocent bystanders donÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t smash windows and generally follow verbal instructions by the authorities in a crisis situation?&#8221;</p>
<p>And exactly how should they do that? If the police are scattered around the general area where the anarchist are, there is no way they can do their job effectively. There really is a reason why the riot police works as large team and not as individuals. When it comes to the police chasing window-breaking criminals, the police has already failed.</p>
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		<title>By: aet75</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89941</link>
		<dc:creator>aet75</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 13:35:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89941</guid>
		<description>#65: Perhaps from the fact that innocent bystanders don&#039;t smash windows and generally follow verbal instructions by the authorities in a crisis situation?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#65: Perhaps from the fact that innocent bystanders don&#8217;t smash windows and generally follow verbal instructions by the authorities in a crisis situation?</p>
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		<title>By: superiorinferior</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89915</link>
		<dc:creator>superiorinferior</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 12:33:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89915</guid>
		<description>&quot;American policemen are upto illegal behaviour?Surely you will provide examplesÃ¢â‚¬â€œ I mean it isnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t like the ACLU, review boards, DA, etcÃ¢â‚¬Â¦ have any jurisdiction over law enforcement indivuals and their behavior in the performance of their duites in the US. Sometimes your hyperbole is beyond obscene. Grow the fuck up.  &quot; Comment by Buckeye Abroad Ã¢â‚¬â€ Thu, Sep 14th, 2006 @ 1:24 am


..... http://www3.sympatico.ca/ron666/bcnd.html 

listen to this podcast! it is unbelievable what the cops are doing in the US. It&#039;s called &quot;Bad Cop, No Donut&quot; and is a biweekly(?) half-hour summary of all crimes committed by police across the US. it is terrifying how the list just goes on and on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;American policemen are upto illegal behaviour?Surely you will provide examplesÃ¢â‚¬â€œ I mean it isnÃ¢â‚¬â„¢t like the ACLU, review boards, DA, etcÃ¢â‚¬Â¦ have any jurisdiction over law enforcement indivuals and their behavior in the performance of their duites in the US. Sometimes your hyperbole is beyond obscene. Grow the fuck up.  &#8221; Comment by Buckeye Abroad Ã¢â‚¬â€ Thu, Sep 14th, 2006 @ 1:24 am</p>
<p>&#8230;.. <a href="http://www3.sympatico.ca/ron666/bcnd.html" rel="nofollow">http://www3.sympatico.ca/ron666/bcnd.html</a> </p>
<p>listen to this podcast! it is unbelievable what the cops are doing in the US. It&#8217;s called &#8220;Bad Cop, No Donut&#8221; and is a biweekly(?) half-hour summary of all crimes committed by police across the US. it is terrifying how the list just goes on and on.</p>
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		<title>By: hfb</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89840</link>
		<dc:creator>hfb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 08:37:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89840</guid>
		<description>Hank - What, do you take down names and addresses of those you photograph? If I read correctly, they were asking for personal details before releasing those detained.

You really do have to wonder though....SUPO claims it&#039;s on top of the Finnish threat of terrorism on domestic soil but a bunch of kids with a few chains and such get the full riot brigade? It&#039;s not really a confidence builder in the local intelligence network.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hank &#8211; What, do you take down names and addresses of those you photograph? If I read correctly, they were asking for personal details before releasing those detained.</p>
<p>You really do have to wonder though&#8230;.SUPO claims it&#8217;s on top of the Finnish threat of terrorism on domestic soil but a bunch of kids with a few chains and such get the full riot brigade? It&#8217;s not really a confidence builder in the local intelligence network.</p>
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		<title>By: Olli</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89832</link>
		<dc:creator>Olli</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 08:05:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89832</guid>
		<description>AnonyMeaCulpa,

Please explain to me how you, an imaginary police officer would differentiate the anarchist from the innocent bystander, aside from the obvious Armani Suit vs. The Punk -distinction? Because when the day comes that I want to get all rowdy in downtown Hki, the Armani suit is exactly what I&#039;m going to wear in order to disguise myself. The police obviously had to concentrate on EVERYBODY, and that really is the dumb teens&#039; fault. If the police allows one person to get out, next there&#039;s going to be a whole bunch of anarchist sweet-talking to the officers get out of the circle.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>AnonyMeaCulpa,</p>
<p>Please explain to me how you, an imaginary police officer would differentiate the anarchist from the innocent bystander, aside from the obvious Armani Suit vs. The Punk -distinction? Because when the day comes that I want to get all rowdy in downtown Hki, the Armani suit is exactly what I&#8217;m going to wear in order to disguise myself. The police obviously had to concentrate on EVERYBODY, and that really is the dumb teens&#8217; fault. If the police allows one person to get out, next there&#8217;s going to be a whole bunch of anarchist sweet-talking to the officers get out of the circle.</p>
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		<title>By: issi</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89787</link>
		<dc:creator>issi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 05:49:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89787</guid>
		<description>http://lehti.samizdat.info/2006/09/13/1754/

Sorry, in finnish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><a href="http://lehti.samizdat.info/2006/09/13/1754/" rel="nofollow">http://lehti.samizdat.info/2006/09/13/1754/</a></p>
<p>Sorry, in finnish.</p>
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		<title>By: AnonyMeaCulpa</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89784</link>
		<dc:creator>AnonyMeaCulpa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 05:40:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89784</guid>
		<description>Police did the right thing in arresting a load of innocent bystanders, instead of concentrating on who actually DID riot etcetera? Yeah, riiiight... 

Now listen up, all you police-state groupies out there: please take your heads out of your asses and kindly wait for the parliamentary ombudsman to reach a verdict about the matter before delving any deeper into that embarassing jackboot-licking subservience of yours. Or, failing that, how about bending over and saying &quot;AAAAAAAH&quot; while I shove a nightstick up your anus? 

It constantly amazes me how certain idiots just don&#039;t understand how it&#039;s THEM who might suffer next time, should this policy of blanket arrests in the name of &quot;security&quot; become status quo. But hey, there&#039;s no cure for stupidity, is there?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Police did the right thing in arresting a load of innocent bystanders, instead of concentrating on who actually DID riot etcetera? Yeah, riiiight&#8230; </p>
<p>Now listen up, all you police-state groupies out there: please take your heads out of your asses and kindly wait for the parliamentary ombudsman to reach a verdict about the matter before delving any deeper into that embarassing jackboot-licking subservience of yours. Or, failing that, how about bending over and saying &#8220;AAAAAAAH&#8221; while I shove a nightstick up your anus? </p>
<p>It constantly amazes me how certain idiots just don&#8217;t understand how it&#8217;s THEM who might suffer next time, should this policy of blanket arrests in the name of &#8220;security&#8221; become status quo. But hey, there&#8217;s no cure for stupidity, is there?</p>
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		<title>By: Boyle</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89772</link>
		<dc:creator>Boyle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Sep 2006 05:01:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89772</guid>
		<description>Phil is expecting a lot things.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Phil is expecting a lot things.</p>
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		<title>By: Buckeye Abroad</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89659</link>
		<dc:creator>Buckeye Abroad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Sep 2006 22:24:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89659</guid>
		<description>&quot;During this weekendÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s ASEM demostrations in Helsinki, the Finnish police went well beyond their rights and turned the downtown area into something resembling a modern-day police state - IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢d expect this kind of illegal behavior by the poÃ¢â‚¬â„¢lice in the states but not here in FinlandÃ¢â‚¬Â¦&quot;

Phil,

American policmen are now enforcing a police state?  Which police departments are you referring too and where-- city, county, state?  Or all of them?  American policemen are upto illegal behaviour?  Surely you will provide examples-- I mean it isn&#039;t like the ACLU, review boards, DA, etc... have any jurisdiction over law enforcement indivuals and their behavior in the performance of their duites in the US.

Sometimes your hyperbole is beyond obscene.  Grow the fuck up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;During this weekendÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s ASEM demostrations in Helsinki, the Finnish police went well beyond their rights and turned the downtown area into something resembling a modern-day police state &#8211; IÃ¢â‚¬â„¢d expect this kind of illegal behavior by the poÃ¢â‚¬â„¢lice in the states but not here in FinlandÃ¢â‚¬Â¦&#8221;</p>
<p>Phil,</p>
<p>American policmen are now enforcing a police state?  Which police departments are you referring too and where&#8211; city, county, state?  Or all of them?  American policemen are upto illegal behaviour?  Surely you will provide examples&#8211; I mean it isn&#8217;t like the ACLU, review boards, DA, etc&#8230; have any jurisdiction over law enforcement indivuals and their behavior in the performance of their duites in the US.</p>
<p>Sometimes your hyperbole is beyond obscene.  Grow the fuck up.</p>
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		<title>By: Antti (the redneck one)</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89630</link>
		<dc:creator>Antti (the redneck one)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Sep 2006 20:31:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89630</guid>
		<description>In the old days Nokia really answered to all your communication needs. From the billyclubs to damned 217 company radio and the artillery fire management systems. I think most of it is now a part of EADS, as it was a bit of burden for the touchy feely &quot;connecting people&quot; brand. I remember the guy, who first programmed the Marksman  game for the last Nokia NMT phone. The name had to be changed to React! and you were &quot;shooting&quot; vegetables.

Hmmm, if you work in the industry producing Nokian youth counsellors, you belong to Rubber and Leather Workers Union. (I think their office is in Hakaniemi)

OK, I could take my mind out of gutter, if someone gives me the ladder.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the old days Nokia really answered to all your communication needs. From the billyclubs to damned 217 company radio and the artillery fire management systems. I think most of it is now a part of EADS, as it was a bit of burden for the touchy feely &#8220;connecting people&#8221; brand. I remember the guy, who first programmed the Marksman  game for the last Nokia NMT phone. The name had to be changed to React! and you were &#8220;shooting&#8221; vegetables.</p>
<p>Hmmm, if you work in the industry producing Nokian youth counsellors, you belong to Rubber and Leather Workers Union. (I think their office is in Hakaniemi)</p>
<p>OK, I could take my mind out of gutter, if someone gives me the ladder.</p>
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		<title>By: Hank W.</title>
		<link>http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/comment-page-2/#comment-89612</link>
		<dc:creator>Hank W.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Sep 2006 19:39:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.finlandforthought.net/2006/09/12/police-state-finland/#comment-89612</guid>
		<description>#56 &lt;i&gt;Nokian youth counsellor&lt;/i&gt;

:lol: oh man... needed to re-wire that a few times in the brain, even I am supposedly notorious making &quot;direct translations&quot;

For the innocents: Nokia=black rubber products like boots, tyres and billyclubs... the copper wrapped in rubber spawned some telephone thing...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#56 <i>Nokian youth counsellor</i></p>
<p> <img src='http://www.finlandforthought.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_lol.gif' alt=':lol:' class='wp-smiley' />  oh man&#8230; needed to re-wire that a few times in the brain, even I am supposedly notorious making &#8220;direct translations&#8221;</p>
<p>For the innocents: Nokia=black rubber products like boots, tyres and billyclubs&#8230; the copper wrapped in rubber spawned some telephone thing&#8230;</p>
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