Racial attack on refugees near Kotka
Just curious - why is the state placing refugees out in Nowheremäki where racial intolerance runs deep? Wouldn’t these people fare much better in Finland’s larger cities along with other foreigners from their home country who can support them? The state is just throwing them in the lion’s den by placing them in these towns.
Two young men have been in the south coast city Kotka in the aftermath of an incident in which a group of men attacked a building housing refugees from Myanmar - formerly Burma. About 20 young men broke windows of a public housing apartment house in the city’s Suulisniemi district on Wednesday. The building is home to 40 Myanmar refugees who arrived in Finland in April as part of this country’s refugee quota.
[...]Junkkari says that on previous occasions police had received scattered reports of windows of refugees’ apartments being broken in the same area, as well as clashes between people of different nationalities, but the latest one was more extensive than before. Social Worker Virpi Kupiainen has spoken with the refugees themselves after the attack. She says that the predominant emotions are great anguish and fear. “We tried to offer them the possibility to go somewhere else provisionally, but they decided that they did not want to leave, because they would have to come back anyway.”
Racial discrimination between asians(blonde asians) and asian refugees. Funny. Finns should know where there ancestors migrated from.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 2:48 pm
Ancient finns are from Volga River area and arriving here were mixed with people from northwestern/central Europe. So no real Asian inheritance.
But racism in any form is revolting, no matter who’s the culprit and who’s the victim or from what ethnic backgrounds they hail from.
Comment by Ã…boy — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 2:57 pm
[Edit: "Ancient finns were from.."]
Comment by Ã…boy — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 3:00 pm
I have been living in Kotka for years and Karhuvuori is the worst place to place the refuugees. It is already occupied by drug users, alcoholics, unemployed etc. And then the city decides to put there the foreigners as well. There is just no sense in their decisions. I bet the immigrants and the refuugees would live quite peacefully on their own, if there weren’t these Finns that already search for trouble anywhere they can. I see no reason why these foreigners couldn’t be placed there where there aren’t allready these troublemakers.
Comment by Visitor — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 3:23 pm
Don’t these malcontents see that these people might bring us an alternative to Kalakakku?
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 3:53 pm
About that larger cities part; It is probaply thought that the foreigners should be spread around evenly, to make sure that they wouldnt become majority in any given area. This would ensure better integration with the orginal population. Anyway, Kotka is by no means a small town.
I have not thought this thru, so I might be wrong; placing foreign family into small town might actually be very good idea. In small community they would integrate very fast and easily find a niche previously left unclaimed. In larger towns the foreigners would stay faceless, which would make them easy pickings for racism.
My family has a cottage in the Somero-area, and one of the local towns has a kebab- and internet-cafe, both run by immigrants. The internet-cafe started only recently, but apparently the kebab-place is doing very well, as the alternative for quick-snack is the local Shell QuickBar. Would think the internet-cafe would be great place for social interaction for youngsters.. apparently its the only such place till Helsinki.
Comment by iJusten — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 3:58 pm
#4 …And then city decides…
Refugees are placed were the city has apartments available.
In Kotka the downtown would be ideal place, mostly senior citizens there, but no available apartments.
And there is no place where this couldn’t happen in Finland. Or is Espoo totally free of racism and stupidity? Let’s put up new China… eh, Myanmartown there?
Concentrating refugees to their own areas would be against the idea of integrating these people in society. And of course it would slow down finnish society’s itergation in modern world.
It would be like medicine for the symptom, not for the disease -racism.
Comment by issi — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 3:58 pm
Just like a white man entering any downtown X in the USA. Oops.. did I mention a race..
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:01 pm
“Ancient Finns” (”suomet”, suomalaiset) used to live in Finland proper, the area around present-day Turku …
Anyway, the report talks about “clashes between people of different nationalities”. I don’t know if that refers to Finns or what.
The refugees are “distributed” to different regions because of the pretty weird regional politics we have. Usually they live in Nowheremäki till they feel safe enough languagewise or what not to move to Helsinki or Turku (sometimes even elsewhere).
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:06 pm
In French cities the immigrants are stuffed into small suburbs of their own so they wouldn’t get “on the French nerve”. Those neighborhoods are full of frustration and fear for “white men”.
Racism stays as long as the government is not doing more to integrate people. It’s all about fear of something else than cozy and familiar.
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:06 pm
Ã…boy, Volga region and Russian steps were the place where asian people used to live. They were nomadic people sweeping from the east Siberia and northern china to Volga and the Black Sea area. Finns came from the place and and Finns are genetically linguistically and culturally asians. Even though Finns want to deny their asian connection because of “racism” of “advanced europeans” and “retarded Asians”, the genetics, language and culture don’t deny the fact.
This is truly funny racism widespread in Finland. When they are asians, they deny becaue Finns think asians are retarded than europeans.
Are Turks european or aisans? That’s the difficult question as Finns are euroepans or asians.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:07 pm
#9, All men came from Africa. There are no Ancient people who lived there from the beginning of the world.
But of course, we are asking where the Finns came from in the near past. Hungarians and Finns came from the Russian stepps.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:15 pm
it is true that all the nordic people and germanic people left from the same nomadic center in central asia. Finnish language less connected to Hungarian than Swedish to Persian - according to anthropologist reviews.
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:22 pm
Funny:
Finnish consider Asians retarded? How come? Are you a Finn?
As far as I know Finns consider Asian quite intelligent, read the latest Kehitys-magazine, the story about Chinese inheritance for innovation policies. Finland is establishing a Chinese school in Helsinki, we don’t even have a decent amount of English/French/German schools!
Finns consider Americans retarded.
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:25 pm
EU Civil Servant,
then why do Finns deny that they are Asians?
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:30 pm
“…Volga region and Russian steps were the place where asian people used to live. [...] Finns came from the place and and Finns are genetically linguistically and culturally asians.”
Shhhhhh! Just don’t say anything about the Mongols—you know, from the other side of the Altaic Mountains. We don’t want to hear about it
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:33 pm
Why do white people deny that their Asians?
Because they are not asians. The linguisvistc path just doesn’t go the same way as the racial path. The culture we can forget in the first place as it changes on a daily basis.
Finns are as much of Asians are Americans are. No way, Americans are even more (native Americans, asian immigrants, and this white man connection)
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:35 pm
Kristian, I don’t say of the Mongols by the reason you know. Anyway, Finns are not related to the Mongols.
Finns are related to PanCentral Asians not the Mongols.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:39 pm
then why do Finns deny that they are Asians?
Could it be because there happens to be no evidence, not genetic, linguistic, nor anthropological, supporting such a view?
Well, you’re just trolling, of course: “Let’s see what happens if I write this age-old theory here, perhaps somebody takes a bite and I can chuckle here by myself.
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:41 pm
EU Civil Servant,
Language does not agree with genes. But for Finns’ case if you look at their face once, you can’t deny that they are asians with blone hair. And culturally even though they are Christianized and europeanized by the Swedish influence, still Finns are keeping their asian culture in the heart.
Americans? They are americans. Their language and genes and culture are totally different from Asians.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:43 pm
#19,
There are a bunch of observation about it. Linguistically Finnish is an Asian language, genetically similar to Asians. And of course culturally.
You are a Finn who think Asians are inferior.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:45 pm
#20, oh I missed ‘always’ in the first sentence.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:46 pm
I think the “problem” here is as #4 stated - council housing in the local “Jakomäki”. Of course there are “free” flats in that local “Jakomäki”, as anyone with any common sense moves out from the drug-abuser infested Winoville.
OK, lets say y’all went to live in the USA and the local Nowheremäki council put you live in the Winoville trailer park. So then the local rednecks decided to burn a cross in front of your trailer. Whoopee-fucken-doo.
So do the citizens of Nowheremäki need some multiculturalist propaganda or the rednecks in Winoville sum edumacashun???
Same thing here. Kotka is a *cosmopolitan port city*, used to foreign sailors and such when they’d been quite a novelty inland. And the fact most of the businesses thrive with the Russian trade. So I’d see even more of a “problem” with the Winoville residents than your average man of the street.
And cry me a river - I ave a hunch you’ll find these delinquent youths belonging to a minority themselves.
Comment by Hank W. — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:48 pm
21.
Show the source for a study that says anything about Finnish genetics connected to Asians. Just because you are having an angst by looking at people’s face, doesn’t make it proof.
“American language and culture?” Which one? Mayan or Quetzal?
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:48 pm
You are a Finn who think Asians are inferior.
Actually I think Asians are very bright people. Hell, the top studenst in most western univerities tend to be Asians nowadays. Unfortunately Finns have no proven link to them. We’re just a bunch of regular Europeans. Now, have you had your fun already?
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:54 pm
EU Civil Servant, Finnish is not an Asian language (as far as anybody knows) but east-European with a strong influence from another east-European language group, the Indo-european one.
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 4:57 pm
Nope, didn’t mean that Finnish is an Asian language, sorry mispoke. But they say that Ainu-people (native tribe) has some similar words as Finnish. But as it is, lingvuistic paths are bizarre. In Finno-Ugrian familytree of language one end is Finnish and the other Hungarian.
In the German-family tree (can’t remember the fluent name of it) Swedish is really close Persian language. The Basques are related to nobody and they live in the middle of Europe, basically.
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 5:01 pm
Hank - Or, the flip side is that they put them in the shittiest part of winoville because if they make them miserable enough, maybe they’ll leave? Isn’t there some sort of quota for asylum seekers that Finland has to accept as part of the EU?
There was an interesting bit on CNN a month or two ago that was looking into the rise of hate crimes in Russia, but expanded the study to the Baltics and the rest of the EU, and found that the rate of skinhead sorts of hate crimes are increasing all over so I’m sure Finland isn’t immune. They don’t have to be a majority to cause a lot of problems.
Comment by hfb — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 5:07 pm
Hate crimes are not only the problem in Europe, but the whole western world. Some countries are lucky to not have the far-right movement turned into a political party, other than the others..
Comment by EU Civil Servant — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 5:09 pm
The quota refugees are distributed to different counties according to whose turn it is to take them - IIRC counties volunteer. If the county has luxury housing in Winoville, well, thats what you get if you go asking for a council flat.
Comment by Hank W. — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 5:23 pm
Wait a minute…
We do have Siberian genes. I think I once read that about a quarter of our genes are Siberian. Isn’t Siberia part of Asia?
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 5:27 pm
Apart from which, “quota refugees” are in with a A-permit eligible for work etc. etc. etc. They don’t have to apply for any resident permits like some third-world immigrants like from the USA. The “logic” would work if the question was of housing “asylum seekers” who come on their own and usually are housed in the “refugee centres” r then the so-called “B-permit” people. The “quota refugees” are the highest on the pecking order, their stuff is “organized” in the system. Immigrants from the USA, asylum seekers, B-permits… all those are “extra work not planned” whose leaving would be in the interest of a lazy bureaucrat. And IIRC the county gets money off the government for all this.
As Phil would put this - blame the “nanny state” - own initiative=bad, state initiative=good.
Comment by Hank W. — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 5:27 pm
“…Finns are not related to the Mongols. Finns are related to PanCentral Asians not the Mongols. ”
That was a fear of Finns back when they started doing these genetic studies. Nobody wanted to discover that we were mixed with the Mongols. But, apparently, the Altaic Mountains prevented that from happening.
Incidentally, the whole anti-Mongol thing was a common sentiment throughout much of central and eastern Europe. But, unlike Finland’s case, in c.& e. Europe it was due to the Genghis Khan invasions—stuff nightmares are made of. Like a child gets ripped from its bed and raped by a marauding Mongol tribe and then slashed with a knife and left to die.
Mongols had a particularly barbaric history (as told by Europeans) and weren’t particularly interested in art, etc. Maybe it’s true, maybe not. But, the scenario above seems plausible though.
Not part of Finland’s epic specifically, but, nevertheless, maybe Finns were just echoing those negative sentiments.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 6:08 pm
The race-based concept of Asians and Europeans doesn’t work because “Asian” or “European” are geographic terms. Peoples in Europe are European and peoples in Asia are Asian. Finns, for example, are European for the simple reason that they’ve lived in Europe for millennia. Their genes have nothing to do with the issue.
Comment by a lamb with no guiding light — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 6:26 pm
On the origins of Finns:
http://virtual.finland.fi/finfo/english/where_do.html
Comment by Ã…boy — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 6:34 pm
This is an interesting part in the article:
Kotka immigration coordinator Jaana Kosonen hopes that the events would lead to an open discussion on tolerance. She said that since the events on Wednesday, many city residents have contacted her.
“The message was that this kind of thing is not acceptable, and that such acts have no place in our city.
While it is commendable that Kotka residents contact the authorities to offer help, I was struck by one thing: nowhere does it describe Finnish residents contacting the immigrants directly to offer moral support, or any kind of support. I’d think if that had happened, the article would have mentioned it.
In America, when these kinds of incidents happen, many outraged Americans react by directly contacting immigrants in offers of support. They simply go to their doors, knock, introduce themselves, and offer help, mostly in the form of their personal names, addresses and phone numbers, with an invitation for the immigrant to call them if they need any help in any kind of emergency. Such tactics tend to work, as locals are better positioned to act to defend immigrants from harassment, in terms of providing witness to the incidents. It also helps reassure the immigrants that they are not alone, and that there are concerned citizens who care about them, in a much better way than some state officials are ever able to do.
Finns still have a long way to go in learning how to deal with immigrants.
Comment by Finnpundit — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 6:42 pm
Hi Finnpundit
Regarding nr 36, I think that is really good that the Americans do this. However, I don’t think you should read any less outrage into the Finnish people not doing this. This is more down to the way we are. We’re just a little bit shy to get as involved in someone else’s life like this. It’s rather hard to explain… but I suppose we’re not so forthcoming.
In fact, if Finnish people did this to another Finnish person they are quite like to see it as an unwanted intrusion rather than as support. I know that may sound strange, or even a little bit crazy, but it’s just in someway our mentality in these matters. I would imagine this is one reason why the Finns don’t act in this same outwardly obviously supportive way as you cite that Americans do.
Comment by JG — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 6:53 pm
Many members of my own family clearly have the Asiatic untermenschen features that are being discussed here. They’re very white skinned; but nonetheless, the other features are unmistakable. It makes sense though; it’s not like people with Asian features are only found in China. Changes in physical features tend to be gradual as one travels eastward. I noticed it in Poland, Czech R. Slovakia and Hungary too.
By the way, some people even say that I look sort of Asian, but that’s usually after a long night of… er, celebrating
Since we’re caught in the semantics of geographic vs. race descriptions, perhaps we should refer to the theoretical anthropological classifications of caucasoids, mongoloids and negroids?
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 7:24 pm
Actually I think that sending foreigneers to small town is a good idea. Here in Quebec, Canada, all the immigrants stays in the capital, Montreal, and what happens is that now almost everybody speak english, although Quebec is a French province. It’s pissing me off that foreigners come to our province, knowing that it’s french (even though english and french are official in Canada) and they don’t try to learn french. When they arrive here, a lot of them don’t speak english nor french but they chose to live HERE in english. So I think that sending foreigners to small town, were less people speak english, is a good way to keep the culture of a country.
Comment by Lyzz — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 7:54 pm
#34,
I agree with you in the point that Finns are europeans geographically and politically.
But the racial discrimination does not come from such geography or politics. For example, by definition Somalis immigrants in Finland or Pakistani-Britons in UK are politically europeans. But actually in those societies Somalis refugees are regarded as Africans and Pakistani-Britons as Asians without regard to their actual nationality in their passports.
That’s the origin of all racial discrimination issues.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 10:08 pm
Kristina,
You are the first honest finn in this sense I think. I have seen bunch of Asian-Finns who deny their ancestors and insist that they are Eropean-Finns.
In this sense I think most Finns are racists in their hearts.
Comment by funny — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 10:10 pm
#36 Some stranger came once and knocked on my door once, I chased them down the stairs with a baseball bat. Haven’t you heard of *privacy*… crazy Americans.
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 10:21 pm
Funny, the only racist here is you. Does not matter if its Asian or Australian. Finns do not like *anybody* who is not from their *own tribe*. If you read Finnish history, the different tribes fought each other until the 1600’s even.
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 10:24 pm
well, what’s certain anyways is that “funny” is not of Asian ancestry. He’s not bright enough
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 10:45 pm
37: This is more down to the way we are. We’re just a little bit shy to get as involved in someone else’s life like this. It’s rather hard to explain… but I suppose we’re not so forthcoming.
Well, yes, it does take courage to act according to your beliefs, - something Finns sorely lack.
Comment by Finnpundit — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 11:14 pm
Well, now you see people act according to their beliefs. They just have a strong belief foreigners, like Finnpundit, have no place in Finland. however there is no praise for their courage? Come on now?
Comment by Anonymous — Mon, Aug 28th, 2006 @ 11:43 pm
To house refugees from Myanmar in Karhuvuori is as smart as Ehud Olmert buying a condo in South Beirut.
Comment by Petteri — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 12:59 am
Nr 44: I am sorry to be blunt, but I think you simply haven’t understood what I have said about the majority Finnish characteristic in such matters. Perhaps you don’t understand that there are differences between different cultures.
As I said, I think it’s great that Americans think of the positive interaction and knocking on the door etc (as you helpfully describe) works in the USA. But, it’s simply not the way that Finnish people would do things, or indeed as a vast majority would welcome it. If I was beaten up by some local hooligan and all my neighbours started knocking on my door to offer support I would a) think it very strange and b) feel very awkward that it was happening and that my business was so publically known.
Again, what works and is suited to one culture is not always the same as what works and is suited to another culture. That does not necessarily equal that one method is superior to the other.
Comment by JG — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 1:17 am
There’s probably also a language barrier to consider. Since Finns aren’t communicatively gifted to begin with, going to someone who might not understand them anyway is an awkward experience.
And, generally speaking, when it comes to Third World immigration, a common attitude among Finns might be that the government made these deals against their wishes. The people had no choice but to accept.
I don’t hold anti-foreigner views myself, but I understand why people feel this way. Finland is not an immigrant country like America. Just because America is open to all types of immigration, doesn’t mean that Finland is obligated to be the same way—regardless of what the government does.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 2:08 am
If I was beaten up by some local hooligan and all my neighbours started knocking on my door to offer support I would a) think it very strange and b) feel very awkward that it was happening and that my business was so publically known.
But you’re not an immigrant to a foreign culture. Believe, as an immigrant to a foreign culture, there’s nothing like a neighbor coming knocking on your door an introducing themselves to you and your family, as I’ve known and experienced it.
America simply excels in how to treat immigrants, even with all the media-generated controversies today.
Comment by Finnpundit — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 6:23 am
America is open to all types of immigration
Say what? You’re joking, aren’t you?
Comment by Anonymous — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 6:49 am
Having lived in Asia, Finland and the United States, and being bilingual in both Finnish and English, I have to say that Finnpundit is right on the money when he states, “America simply excels in how to treat immigrants.” And there’s a stronger sense of community activism here, too.
There’s no comparison. America’s a country of immigrants, founded by immigrants, and deeply bighearted about extending a hand. There are stories every day of midwestern families adopting orphans from Russia, Africa, and China; volunteerism runs high, and high school classes often require community work. America is the largest financial supporter of the UN and celebrities as well as business leaders such as Bill Gates donate colossal amounts to local and international charities. Neighborhood Watch (crime fighting) community block parties happen in my community every summer, and my Vietnam Vet as well as German immigrant neighbors greet each other coming and going.
Yes, there are cultural differences. But there’s a grim, stoic loneliness to Finnish culture that I find isolating and not too kind, and while American society has its flaws - and phoniness - there’s warmth here, too.
That’s why I call it home.
Comment by AmeriikanEnkeli — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 7:10 am
Nr 49, In a way I suppose that is true. Although I do live in Sweden (Finnish company has sent me here), but i suppose it would be hard to imagine a less foreign foreign country, especially as my mother tongue is Swedish. Although it’s quite surprising how little the Swedes are aware of the Swedish speaking Finns.
But again, I am sure it could be very nice for an immigrant to have his or her neighbours doing as you say, but it’s not so much anything against immigrants that this is not the common case in Finland, it’s just not the Finnish way of doing things. Many of us go for years at a time without saying more than Hej/Hei to our fellow Finnish nextdoor neighbours in the same apartment house!
Comment by JG — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 7:53 am
AmeriikanEnkeli, You may be bilingual but you apparently don’t know much about Finland, if you think for example that adopting foreign orphans sets the USA apart from Finland. Or neighborhood wathces, or the amount of volunteerism. It’s true though that charity is more common in the US but then again the need for it in Finland is smaller. But, yeah, I like the idea over there saying that “if you’ve been given a lot, you should also give back a lot”. Then again the foreign help in general is much smaller than in Finland (per capita, of course), so it’s not all that clear that the rule applies to “outsiders” particularly well.
The history of the US immigration has many very dark pages, in particular when dealing with those who didn’t happen to belong to the “Anglo-Saxon” or later on the “white race”. Racism still runs deep here and there but the overall situation is much better nowadays. For example it’s equally hard for everybody, regardless of “race” that is, to get to move into the USA - at least officially.
That said, I, too, like the “warmth” of many middle-class communities in the USA (I have no experience of slums or upper-class areas). That’s something Finns could learn from.
Comment by SuomenPiru — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 9:32 am
Small scale immigration of Vietnamese seems to be smooth in the Kokkola/Vaasa/Pietarsaari areas compared to certain other non white groups. Politicians are loathed to comment and it is dangerous to stamp all people the same, but work ethic is one key difference. The vietnamese work like stink… even peeing off the locals in the process who are made to look (and often are thanks to unions) lazy.
Comment by Jansons Fisk — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 1:04 pm
Revenge established as motive for racist attack in Kotka
According to local police, revenge was the motive behind the racist attack against the Kotka apartment block housing refugees from Myanmar.
The chain of events began with a fight between a Finnish Kotka resident and a foreign man in Aatteenkatu in Kotka’s Suulisniemi district. Later, a group of young Finnish men returned to Aatteenkatu for retaliation, in the process of which they smashed dozens of windows of apartments occupied by refugees.
The police are investigating the incident as wilful damage and aggravated disturbance of domestic peace. The fight is being looked into as assault. In the course of the investigation, three young men from Kotka were detained for questioning, but at present there are no people being held in custody.
Comment by Hank W. — Tue, Aug 29th, 2006 @ 3:05 pm
Racism is alive and well everywhere, unfortunately. In Louisisana, a school bus driver has been suspended because he forced black children to sit in the back of the school bus. It is so ugly.
Amerikan Enkeli: as someone who grew up in Finland and now lives in the States, I can tell you that what you describe is, infact, a cultural difference. It still bothers me that people I don’t know just come up and start talking to me. Recently, while waiting at a doctor’s office, some woman, who never introduced herself, gave me her entire life story in 40 minutes. I will never, ever get used to that kind of familiarity with complete strangers no matter how long I live here. Call it cultural dissonance.
Comment by nipsu — Wed, Aug 30th, 2006 @ 2:38 am
Nipsu,
I know what you mean about the personal stories in such a short time. I can usually brush those folks off by staring quietly into the distance, or giving short responses. There are times when that kind of familiarity is annoying, I’ll grant, and yet it’s precisely that kind of friendliness that’s opened the door to new friendships, new perspectives, and an openness that I genuinely enjoy. Cultural? Personal? Who knows. But I still prefer it to the aloof stoicism of the “leave me alone to deal with it” style.
And many of my Finnish friends who’ve moved here say the same.
Piru,
I’m not saying that Finns and other societies don’t adopt foreign orphans. Or that they aren’t philanthrophic. But on a global scale, the USA is by far the leader in charity. Not just financially, but in volunteerism as well. Doctors Without Borders, Habitat for Humanity, even the Peace Corps - all started here, and are just a few examples. And of course racism exists here - we’d be foolish to deny it.
And yet the bright side of American “phoniness” and “familiarity” is the willingness to debate even uncomfortable issues with candor. And not to hold grudges or to resort to “kateus” when someone else succeeds.
Best wishes.
Comment by AmeriikanEnkeli — Wed, Aug 30th, 2006 @ 6:42 am
57, Médecins Sans Frontières/Doctors without Borders/Läkare Utan Gränser or whatever you wish to call it was definately set up by some French doctors. I can’t remember the exact event that caused them to establish it, but it was some kind of crisis/famine in Africa I think.
They have quite a large profile here in Sweden also, quite a few campaign adverts at bus stops at the moment.
Comment by JG — Wed, Aug 30th, 2006 @ 8:58 am
“Racism is alive and well everywhere, unfortunately. In Louisisana, a school bus driver has been suspended because he forced black children to sit in the back of the school bus. It is so ugly.”
I know the south still has deeply routed racism. I stopped at a small ice cream stand in Georgia once (on my way to FLA) and a white girl who worked there started yelling and calling some black girl a “nigger”, telling her to leave. It was very dramatic.
The flip-side, unfortunately, is that there are many cases where non-whites (read blacks) wrongly accuse whites of discriminating against them. For example, maybe these school bus kids have been a loud distraction to the driver, so the driver prefers they sit in the back. He might also make loud white children sit in the back. Might be the case, might not. But the true context easily becomes obscured in these matters.
These problems also exist in the workplace. Employers constantly have to be on-guard for black employees who’d like to profit by alledging racism. In some cases it’s justified, some not. In either case, the legal fees can be very expensive.
I’m very glad we don’t have that situation here in Europe—at least not to such an extent. I think it’s a major cause of tension in America. We are better without it.
Comment by Kristian (in Espoo) — Wed, Aug 30th, 2006 @ 9:54 am
They need not to integrate, and they need not to be treated as immigrants. They are refugees. They came to Finland to wait until there’s a stable peace in their homecountry. When the peace will be established, they must return to their homeland, live there happily and build their own society. Therefore, trying to integrate them is stupid, they simply need to sit silently in the flats they were given by Finnish generousity and wait. They “goodbye and back home” and we’ll probably come to visit them as tourists.
Comment by Anonymous — Thu, Aug 31st, 2006 @ 11:40 am
With such foolish thinking, on immigration,
I can’t see our blonde hair
and our blue eyes
surviving .
Comment by Phinn — Fri, May 4th, 2007 @ 7:43 am
arr lone ko lee bal
Comment by min way — Wed, Jan 30th, 2008 @ 5:50 pm
Wonderful comments. Altai Mountain is not the geographical barrier to Mongols, they scattered all around Central Asia. Finns are originally from Mongolia. You have a Mongolian gene in your blood.
Comment by Jorig — Mon, Mar 3rd, 2008 @ 10:23 pm