Thats the tax office making its own rules. nothing new in that. Theres two inistries, government offices etc. one says one thing, the other the other. Main objective: NO MONEY OUT, ALL MONEY IN.

What’s the deal with being forced to pay taxes, and then being told that you don’t qualify for health insurance, because you don’t earn enough.

Whatever happened to “Social Welfare” and ‘Universal Health Care?’

When I started working under my student visa and began paying tax I went to apply for a KELA card. Of course I too did not qualify. I however could get a KELA card if I was living with a girlfriend. I pointed out that she was not encouraging good behavior.

My favorite comment on the matter was when I asked at the police station when renewing my visa about paying taxes and not getting benefits. The reply was:

“Everyone is welcome to pay taxes to Finland.”

“Free healthcare for all” is really just “Subsidized healthcare for some”

Fred – in your situation without a KELA card, what if you got seriously ill and medical costs were high, who would have paid?

I’d bet those health care rules are very much the same inside EU. EU citizens are automatically entitled to health care. And what about foreigners in the US? They certainly have to pay for their own health care.

Au pair jobs can sometimes be like modern day slave hell, there are countless examples from Germany and France, where girls have received only maybe 100-200 EUR per month.

“Free healthcare for all” is really just “Subsidized healthcare for some”

That is really true Phil. Now it is not so bad because it is still true that Finland’s health-care system is among the best in the world, there is just a bit of false advertising mixed in.

The bad part in all of this comes into play when the higher powers have somehow fostered the public into thinking they have some basis for trying to fool the international community with claims that they are lottery winners. But more significantly, that the exorbitant prices paid for everything and their near-empty bank accounts 5-days before the monthly pay-day, is somehow worth it all.

Meanwhile, many cannot accept the possibility that maybe, just maybe, the system could cost less while still deliver equal/better services. It’s not like any other countries are doing that …

My MBA classmate who was also an American managed to break his toe one evening. Our Finnish friend drove us to the hospital. The receptionist asked for his finnish Social Security number and when she entered it read out his name. After two hours of waiting, the doctor saw him and taped the broken toe next to the one next to it. The bill should have been for 50 marks, but he never got one.

If I was seriously ill, I suspect that pretty much the same would happen. I would give my number and be admitted. After a while I suspect that I would be confronted about how I intended to pay, but hopefully I would be out cold. The KELA card would have been more useful in at the pharmacy, but even then they did not seem so expensive without one.

Thankfully I did not have to find out first hand. I did not get seriously ill the 3.5 years I lived there. I could have gotten a card the last year but just realized that I never bothered to.

“higher powers have somehow fostered the public into thinking they have some basis for trying to fool the international community with claims that they are lottery winners.”

Oh, I am sorry. Finnish should never feel proud of themselves and feel like lottery winners. Just like…hmm..Canadians! Oh, they never feel too proud and patriotic…yeah, right.

We have the best public schools in the world according to PISA studies and Finland is THE most competitive economy in the world. Of course every society has problems but so what. Nothing ever stays the same forever.

Again, you misunderstand my point. Finns have very much to be proud of, but the idea of being a lottery winner just isn’t one of them. The sooner that happens, the sooner people will start to demand better results for the high taxes paid.

Indeed, the public schools in Finland are excellent, and the Finns’ results from world-wide standardized testing are just as impressive.

Also, Finns should rightfully be proud to be tops on the Global Competitiveness Report.
However, what I would really like to see is a competitive index that is most relevant to the worker/consumer. To me, a competitive society is a dynamic environment where enough companies are competing for my employment (thereby increasing wages and/or perks), and my business (thereby increasing quality and/or decreasing prices).

I would rather see Finland #1 on that list, wouldn’t you?
But to get there, an open mind is needed towards the free-market ideas championed by Finnpundit.

Sorry for going off topic again Phil.

“open mind is needed towards the free-market ideas championed by Finnpundit.”

Well this fanatic “everything got to have a price” free-market idealism is just as bad as pure socialism. Sometimes those markets end up with few big players and who is gonna watch them?

Their pricing power is so big that they can suffocate local business just like Wal-Mart have done in the US. They donate huge sums to politicians and those little whores do exactly as they want them to do. Those pesky environmental laws, who needs them. Business is business. Big business is god, everything else is secondary.

Tim73- sorry but Finland’s competitiveness is an opinion, or at best a “fact” made by manipulating data, as many public studies do. I am soon leaving the country but I have lived here for 5 years with my Finnish spouse and I don’t see the competitiveness. Everything moves at a snail’s pace…many “innovative” projects are forever stuck in the “planning” stage, and time and time again talented and motivated expats come up against brick walls when trying to find opportunities. In fact I’d say that Finland is the opposite of competitive. Everyone has to do everything together, nobody knows how to think for themselves; everyone only wants what the majority wants. Finns are anything but self-motivated. I’d certainly say that Finland has competitive POTENTIAL, but potential is forever potential until someone does something to set it in action.

yankee in suomi: You said it!

When I was living in Finland, it was the third most competitive (2000.) I used to joke at work that there was a huge difference between first and third. (US was #1, Singapore #2)

I was hired for one job as summer help in the port of Helsinki and for three weeks everyone was either on summer holiday or sick leave. That left me to do the work of four. (two people for the morning shift and two others for the evening shift.) Sure there were a couple of people who were concerned and two others who were qualified to do the work that was there, but they never left the office to lend a hand. They were perfectly content that I work both shifts since I was willing to. (and break the law as I later found out.)

I was one of two people that were hired as summer help, the other being a Finn. He quit right after training and went back to his old position, where he worked two hours in the morning and two hours in the afternoon getting the ferries ready. He prefered so sit around all day than earning extra money and having to work all day.

yankee in suomi: Everything moves at a snail’s pace?many “innovative” projects are forever stuck in the “planning” stage, and time and time again talented and motivated expats come up against brick walls when trying to find opportunities.

I was working with several internet start-ups in San Francisco at one time, and I must say the speed in decision-making was breathtaking, even more so than what I was used to in New York. Of course, it meant a lot of money was blown in expensive decisions – mostly in paying too high a price for labor – which drove up the price of labor in general. And when the bubble burst, there were a lot of layoffs. However, everyone that I dealt with is back in business, working on pretty much the same projects, and making the same kinds of money as before.

It just pays to take risks. And its worthwhile to work in an environment which values competition and risk-taking; in the end, moving forward fast is more important than moving forward carefully.

Everything moves at a snail’s pace?many “innovative” projects are forever stuck in the “planning” stage

Right. And you have worked in exactly how many companies? Fred here has worked for the City of Helsinki, for crying out loud (Do yourself a favour and ask around about people’s opinion of city employees), and he’s such an expert on how things are done everywhere here.

I don’t have any reason to defend the Finnish working life – I think it is getting more and more sucky – but these expat experts with six months’ experience are getting a tad annoying.

I was working with several internet start-ups in San Francisco at one time, and I must say the speed in decision-making was breathtaking, even more so than what I was used to in New York. Of course, it meant a lot of money was blown in expensive decisions

That’s exactly how it was in Finland. Lots of stupid decisions were made fast, and lost of money was blown with no results to speak of. Sure, it works, kind of, and is a whole lot of fun, as long as there’s an unlimited supply of money to blow.

Of course, this is no way to manage IT projects. As a market droid, it is way over your head, so I’m wasting my time trying to explain things to you.

It just pays to take risks.

Sometimes. Taking stupid risks almost never pays.

And its worthwhile to work in an environment which values competition and risk-taking; in the end, moving forward fast is more important than moving forward carefully.

Taking one step forward, two backwards and all the while hitting your head against a concrete wall is the way to do it. Fuck yeah!

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Thank you for your thoughts, I agree with your post.